Athletic Department Goals – Straight From The Horse’s Mouth

Back in May of 2008 I posted an entry based on these two quotes from Lee Fowler:

“My goals have always been to be in the top three in the conference. If you’re in the top three you always have a chance to win the championship. That’s an obvious goal as well. Minimum goals, we don’t want to be in the bottom-half of anything.. the bottom-half in any sport.”

–Lee Fowler, PackPride.com, 5-22-08

and

“Our minimum should be middle of the conference, not last in the league”

–Lee Fowler, Technician, 8-31-07

This entry will be an update of the May 2008 entry linked above but will also look at some numbers in a little different way.

Based on those two quotes above, you can come away with at least four distinct goals for our athletic programs.
Goal #1 – ACC Championships
Goal #2 – Top 3 in the ACC
Goal #3 – Top half of the ACC
Goal #4 – Not last place in ACC

I think it is very important to note that these are not goals made by fans with unreasonable expectations or the “lunatic fringe” or “HateFans Nation”. These are goals straight from the mouth of the AD.

A couple of notes before we start looking at those four goals –

(a) I did not keep track of ties in the standings in my research. For example, NC State finished tied for 11th in Men’s Basketball in 2008. While technically we finished tied for last, my notes had us as 11th. Since 11th is not 12th, they did not get counted as a last place finish. This actually errs on the side of the athletic department, and as you will see as you read, they need all the help they can get.

(b) Also, these stats are only for the 21 sports in which NC State participates that are a part of Atlantic Coast Conference sanctioned events and therefore do not include gymnastics or rifle. The 2009-2010 baseball and softball seasons have not been completed so they are not included.

 

Goal #1 – Win ACC Championships
Let’s start with Goal #1, winning an ACC championship, the loftiest goal of the four. In the 10 years Fowler has been AD, NC State has fielded 205 different teams across the 21 sports and brought home 15 ACC titles.

Success Rate for Goal #1 – Win ACC Championships: 7.3%

The Athletics Department has experienced drastic drop after a near-peak of 14.3% in 2007. 2008-2010 has produced a lone ACC Title (this year) in men’s cross country after going two consecutive years without winning a single ACC Championship for the first time in the history of the Athletics Department.

Only four different programs (M Cross Country, W Cross Country, Softball & Wrestling) have won an ACC Championship during Lee Fowler’s tenure in Raleigh, meaning 19% of our programs have met Goal #1 at least once and 81% of our programs have failed over the last 10 years.

 

Goal #2 – Top 3 In the Atlantic Coast Conference
In the 10 years Fowler has been Athletics Director, NC State has fielded 205 different teams in 21 sports and finished in the top three of the conference standings 44 times.

Success Rate for Goal #2 – Top 3: 21.5%

Again, if you look at the success rate by year, after another near-peak in 2007 at 33.3% has been followed by dramatic drop. In the last two years, men’s cross country is the only sport to finish in the top three of the ACC.

13 programs that have finished in the top 3 at least once, meaning 61.9% of our programs have met Goal #2 at least once in a ten year period; while 8 different programs – 38.1% of the programs – have failed to finish in the top 3 of the ACC a single time in 80 different attempts.

 

Goal #3 – Top half of the ACC
This was stated by Fowler in both quotes above as the “bare minimum” goal. In the 10 years Fowler has been AD, NC State has fielded 205 different teams in 21 sports and finished in the top half of the confernce 75 times.

Success Rate for Goal #3 – Top Half: 36.6%

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, if you look at the success rate by year, after a peak success rate of 57.1% in 2006 there has been another drop-off over the last three years.

There are 16 programs that have finished in the top half at least once, meaning 76.2% of our programs have met Goal #3 at least once while five different programs have never finished in the top half of the ACC a single time in the last 10 years.

 

Goal #4 – Don’t finish last in the ACC
In the 10 years Fowler has been AD, NC State has fielded 205 different teams in 21 sports and has avoided sole possession of last place 177 times.

Success Rate for Goal #4 – Not Last: 86.3%

While not as drastic as the other 3 goals, when you look at the yearly success rates there is a drop-off over the last 3 years after peaks of 95.2% in both 2005 and 2006.

There are 10 programs that have never finished in dead last in the ACC, meaning 47.6% of our programs have met Goal #4 each year and every program has met Goal #4 at least once.

Success Rate For The Four Major Sports
What about the success rate for the four major sports (Football, M Basketball, W Basketball, Baseball)?

Success Rate for Goal #1 – ACC Title: 0%
Success Rate for Goal #2 – Top 3: 17.9%
Success Rate for Goal #3 – Top Half: 46.2%
Success Rate for Goal #4 – Not Last: 100%

Success Rate For Football & Men’s Basketball
Some fans only follow football and men’s basketball. Here are the success rates for those 2 sports.

Success Rate for Goal #1 – ACC Title: 0%
Success Rate for Goal #2 – Top 3: 10.0%
Success Rate for Goal #3 – Top Half: 40.0%
Success Rate for Goal #4 – Not Last: 100%

Conclusions and Comments
Let’s look at another quote from Fowler from the Feb 16, 2004 issue of The Wolfpacker:

“By the end of ‘05, we will have most of our programs in the types of facilities that coaches can be held accountable to. I don’t think that was the case when I first got here. I think we had teams competing against people with a lot more assets than we had.”

Wouldn’t logic dictate that after 2005, all our facilities should be in good shape and we should start to reap the benefits? Instead the success rates for all 4 goals are at or near their lowest points over the last 3 years. Things are not getting better or even maintaining the status quo, they are getting worse.

And again, I feel it is very important to remember, these are not goals that I came up with. They were not made by the “lunatic fringe” or posters on the “monkey boards” or “HateFans Nation”. These goals are straight from the AD who claims “I do love NC State” and “I’ve worked hard to make it the best it can be”.

Take another look at Goal #3 – Top Half, which was considered by Fowler to be the minimum goal. Over his tenure as AD this goal has only been met 36.6% of the time. I’m assuming as State grads, we have a few engineers, scientists, researchers, etc. reading this. If your overall success rate for your stated MINIMUM goal is 36.6%, you’ve only hit 50% twice in 10 years, the last 3 years have been your lowest since your first year and your 2 national profile projects are at 40%, are you working hard to make your project the best it can be? Do you get a contract extension? Do you get an award for excellence? Do you still keep your job?

SFN Note: As always, we’ve got quite a lot of topical conversations going on our message boards that you can see by clicking here. We’re trying to add traffic to the 1,000+ readers a day that visit the boards. Thanks!

About WV Wolf

Graduated from NCSU in 1996 with a degree in statistics. Born and inbred in West "By God" Virginia and now live in Raleigh where I spend my time watching the Wolfpack, the Mountaineers and the Carolina Hurricanes as well as making bar graphs for SFN. I'm @wvncsu on the Twitter machine.

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41 Responses to Athletic Department Goals – Straight From The Horse’s Mouth

  1. Daily Update 05/03/2010 at 11:30 AM #

    Good work.

  2. Plz2BStateFan 05/03/2010 at 11:39 AM #

    Hopefully you will not need to put together data like this for much longer. And I hope NC State fans never feel the need to do anything like this anytime soon.

  3. MatSci94 05/03/2010 at 11:46 AM #

    This is what upsets me when the local media people trot out the “you can’t expect to compete with ____ and ___ every year…why are people so upset?” The only level that you could say we are successful is the “show up and get you trophy” leagues for children.

    I think I’m in the minority, but I’ve never been in the camp of “first place and a bunch of losers,” and would consider a top 3 or top 4 season to be a successful one. On the other hand, I think bottom half should be taken as a sign of something wrong, and last place as the sign of something *seriously* wrong. When something is wrong, you have/make a plan to fix it (facilities, recruiting, staff changes, etc). If you have a plan, and things don’t change, thats a sign that you don’t understand why things aren’t working, which is a much more serious problem…which is where we are now.

  4. goforit 05/03/2010 at 11:48 AM #

    You guys are making it too easy for the administration to fire Fowler.

  5. sbas2 05/03/2010 at 12:04 PM #

    State is a basketball school. the success of the basketball team drives the other sports. in the 70’s and 80’s State basketball was outstanding, and other sports did well also. in looking at the statistics, all sports dropped off after 2007 as did the basketball program. while Sendek wasn’t what State fans wanted-he basically tapped out- his success led to more success (as opposed to great success) in the other sports. true or not true?

  6. sbas2 05/03/2010 at 12:06 PM #

    if Lowe leads State basketball back to what it was in the 70’s and 80’s, look for the other sports to also do better. true or not true?

  7. sbas2 05/03/2010 at 12:07 PM #

    don’t know where all those A’s came from at the end of my last post. by the way my comments are not to be taken as support for Fowler in any way, shape or form.

  8. sbas2 05/03/2010 at 12:16 PM #

    it would be interesting to take a look at the results of the big four-football, men’s basketball, women’s basketball, and baseball-in the 70’s and 80’s and compare this result with the result of these four programs after the administration ruined the men’s basketball team in 1991. sorry, i am too lazy to do this at this time.

  9. durhamwolf19 05/03/2010 at 12:28 PM #

    Along with sending this to Chancellor Woodson and Bobby Purcell send this to Mark Thomas, Joe Ovies and JP Giglio who have been espousing the success of Fowler.

  10. wufpup76 05/03/2010 at 12:32 PM #

    Good work …

    As for the local media, I’m hoping they’re doing nothing more than generating talking points. Though some have been fairly vehement in their defense of Coach AD.

    Any purely objective look at things can only lead to one inevitable conclusion though.

  11. JPPack 05/03/2010 at 12:35 PM #

    I’m ready for a new AD as well, but I have to wonder if this site will go down the tubes if Fowler leaves since 99% of the content are dedicated to proving his unworthiness.

  12. StateFans 05/03/2010 at 12:40 PM #

    WV Wolf — Quick question about “not last”.

    I thought basketball finished last a couple of years ago (hence we didn’t get to play in the ACC/Big 10 Challenge). We also have finished last in our division in football a couple of times, haven’t we?

  13. StateFans 05/03/2010 at 12:42 PM #

    “I’m ready for a new AD as well, but I have to wonder if this site will go down the tubes if Fowler leaves since 99% of the content are dedicated to proving his unworthiness.”

    This reminds me of the predictions that Rush Limbaugh will become irrelevant whenever Republicans win…yet, somehow his audience actually grows year after year.

    Similarly…our traffic is actually at its BIGGEST whenever NC State wins. So, I am not worried that optimism and success will be anything but great for all of us.

  14. VaWolf82 05/03/2010 at 12:47 PM #

    Obviously, Fowler doesn’t understand that there’s a difference between working towards a goal and just hoping for the best.

  15. packof81 05/03/2010 at 12:48 PM #

    “… but I have to wonder if this site will go down the tubes if Fowler leaves since 99% of the content are dedicated to proving his unworthiness.”

    If that happens, this site will have served a good purpose.

  16. WV Wolf 05/03/2010 at 12:52 PM #

    Statefans – for basketball that year we tied for 11th/tied for last and probably got the 12 seed in the ACC tourney. The way I did my numbers, last means sole possession of last. If I had it to do over I might have kept track of ties for last but I wasn’t going back and doing all that research again.

    As far as football, I looked at records regardless of division so Duke usually kept us out of the basement.

  17. StateFans 05/03/2010 at 12:58 PM #

    Got it! So…you were even being NICE and CONSERVATIVE with your assessment. WOW!

  18. PoppaJohn 05/03/2010 at 1:00 PM #

    SFN, great analysis – thank you. How did he last so long????

    No chance this site ever goes away. Despite what some would say, we will be the first to cheer WHEN things turnaround.

  19. StateFans 05/03/2010 at 1:09 PM #

    Can you believe that “not being last” is his publicly stated goal?

    We aren’t putting words in his mouth. These are HIS COMMENTS in response to specific questions. You can’t make this stuff up.

  20. EdMar 05/03/2010 at 2:00 PM #

    Very good work! It is amazing that he has lasted this long, but you are not helping the cause of finding him a new job!

  21. CaptainCraptacular 05/03/2010 at 2:40 PM #

    I don’t take away “not last” as a goal in the context of the quotes. I see absolute mnimum goal (and therefore the last word) in both quotes as being Top Half of the league.

    To me, this means that goal #3 is the standard to be reached to have a minimum passing performance grade. In review, the AD has reached ‘passing grade-70%’ on minimum standard performance goals exactly zero times in 10 years. only 2 years did the AD reach even 50%.

    The last 4 years the grade on the absolute minimum is:
    38%
    24%
    28%
    26%

    Absolutely terrible and inexcusable, based on stated performance minimums. To the fans like us, sickening. Truly a wonder there are any fans left. I guess we have a ways to go before reaching the cubs level of futility, but it sure feels like we have the market cornered on the term ‘long suffering’.

  22. ADVENTUROO 05/03/2010 at 2:57 PM #

    Twould appear to me, definitely NOT a FUF fan, that he has been espousing a HOPE & CHANGE philosophy longer than certain politicians who have an equally, to date, dismal record.

    Let’s HOPE that there will be a meaningful CHANGE in the very near future…

    I know where you can a LOT of HOPE and CHANGE bumper stickers, slightly used and pulled off in disgust….the trash cans are full of them about 25 miles from here….

    I hope that all the posters here DO realize that Chanchellor Woodson will be under the gun to hire someone that is equally INEPT. The faculty Senate and the Key ADMIN Leaders are the product of much inbreeding and their genes go directly back to Dr. Monteith.

    He is the exaulted one, if you recall, along with several members of the media (some who are still writing for the local RAG) that is credited with chasing Jimmy V out of town. As an NCSU Alumnus, I was taught to worship St. Patrick, because he was the INVENTOR of the first WORM DRIVE (he chased the serpents out of Ireland).

    Thus, the Faculty Senate and the Key ADMIN members have a St. Monteith medal around their necks and/or a bust of him on the dashes of their Prius’.

    If we REALLY get a GOOD AD that wants to make us COMPETITVE, then GASP, we will return to those villianous days of Jimmy V.

    SO, don’t HOLD your breath….if the Chancelor allows the candidates to be inverviewed by CERTAIN members of his staff and their underlings, then you know that they will discredit anybody who SFN would endorse.

    And the local media….if we actually start to improve, then what will they have to write about….they certainly will NOT be allowed to write about our successes…

    Sarcastic….YES…..Optimistic….WAIT & SEE.

  23. rtpack24 05/03/2010 at 3:52 PM #

    The above post is excellent work. It would be funny if it was not so sad!

  24. old13 05/03/2010 at 4:25 PM #

    Do you realize that if Foulup is really gone, and an AD is hired who can actually bring competitiveness and national notoriety to Wolfpack athletics, we’ll all have to retrain re: how to act and what to discuss other than dismal Wolfpack sports!

  25. tractor57 05/03/2010 at 4:39 PM #

    some of older type actually remember that!

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