The State of State Part One — Overall ACC Records

AD & Department Baseball General NC State Administration NCS Basketball NCS Football Non-Revenue Rankings & Lists Stat of the Day32

Disclaimer: Only facts and statistics will be stated below, you the reader can draw your own conclusions and opinions.

Listed below are the overall ACC records for NC State’s team sports (teams that have a won-loss record) for the eight year time span Lee Fowler has been AD (2000-01 to 2007-08).

Revenue Sports
• Football: 28-36 (.438)
• M Basketball: 60-68 (.469)
• W Basketball: 63-57 (.525)
• Baseball: 109-104 (.512)

Both of the high profile revenue sports, Football and M Basketball, have losing records in ACC play.

Both W Basketball and Baseball have winning records in ACC play.

Non-Revenue Team Sports
• M Soccer: 10-40-5 (.182)
• W Soccer: 11-52-4 (.164)
• Softball: 47-39 (.547)
• M Swimming: 18-30 (.375)
• W Swimming: 11-36 (.234)
• M Tennis: 17-58 (.227)
• W Tennis: 16-59 (.213)
• Volleyball: 3-143 (.021)
• Wrestling: 27-15-1 (.628)

Two non-revenue team sports have a winning record in the ACC:
• Softball
• Wrestling

Six non-revenue team sports have an ACC winning percentage below .250:
• M Soccer
• W Soccer
• W Swimming
• M Tennis
• W Tennis
• Volleyball

Three non-revenue team sports have an ACC winning percentage below .185:
• M Soccer
• W Soccer
• Volleyball (Volleyball has one ACC win over the last six seasons with a record of 1-113)

Coming Soon: A look at improvement in conference standings for the 2007-08 season as well as best/worst finishes under Fowler

About WV Wolf

Graduated from NCSU in 1996 with a degree in statistics. Born and inbred in West "By God" Virginia and now live in Raleigh where I spend my time watching the Wolfpack, the Mountaineers and the Carolina Hurricanes as well as making bar graphs for SFN. I'm @wvncsu on the Twitter machine.

AD & Department Baseball General NC State Administration NCS Basketball NCS Football Non-Revenue Rankings & Lists Stat of the Day

32 Responses to The State of State Part One — Overall ACC Records

  1. PackerInRussia 05/20/2008 at 9:46 PM #

    If I am supposed to look at those numbers and draw any type of positive conclusions then it will take the consumption of some sort of manufactured substance to accomplish that. The only positive comment I can offer is: There are more volleyball wins than I thought.

  2. choppack1 05/20/2008 at 9:46 PM #

    WV Wolf – is there any chance we have these records for the same sports for the 8 period before Fowler arrived? (Or for that matter, just a 4 year period?)

    Those records really are damning. Also, I don’t see Cross Country in there – any reason for the exclusion?

    I see 13 sports, 3 teams w/ winning records, 10 w/ losing records. Not bad!

  3. WV Wolf 05/20/2008 at 10:04 PM #

    choppack1–these stats are only for sports that have won/loss records which is why cross country, golf, track, etc aren’t included. Since the number of schools isn’t constant (every school doesn’t compete in every sport plus ACC expansion) it makes it harder to come up with a meaningful summary statistic for those type of sports.

    I may have some stats for the 4 revenue sports pre-Fowler somewhere but not for anything else.

    I guess I can give an opinion in the comments: Our ACC volleyball record is just incomprehensible. I don’t know how you can be that bad for that long. Not even the LA Clippers or the Tampa Bay Devil Rays are that bad. It might even be worse than Duke football bad. We even fired the old coach and the new coach has gone 0-44 in the ACC.

  4. ruffles31 05/20/2008 at 10:18 PM #

    Volleyball is 3-143 overall and has won one of their last 114 ACC matches? Holy mackerel. Even the Washington Generals probably have a better winning percentage than .021.

    I am speechless. This is a blog and all I have to do is type.

  5. BLUE SUCKS 05/20/2008 at 11:00 PM #

    Over that same span of time, I wonder how we compare to 1) the other ACC schools and 2) the top 50 NCAA schools

    I suppose these numbers will be even more “damning”

    Honestly, is this the best money can buy? What about stewardship? strategy? accountability? leadership? vision?

    All of the above are evident at App State. They (obviously) have the right people at the top. Men’s basketball and men’s football are thriving. Enrollment is way up. Even better, SAT scores for incoming Freshmen are up 42 points over last year. Talk about success breeding success!

    I highly recommend that each of the geniuses at the top read GOOD TO GREAT by Jim Collins. Just a few chapters in and you realize that success doesn’t just happen.

    We need the right people “on the bus” – starting at the top

  6. TampaPack 05/21/2008 at 5:15 AM #

    Wow – those stats are actually much worse than I thought. I thought we would be floating around the .500 mark in most sports, but the truth is we are below that minimum level of acceptability (and most times well below).

    Those super facilities are really paying off across the board. The Chancellor should be handing out even more trophies to this group as obviously there are many “leaders” in the department.

    Oh wait, that’s right what do we know. We are just random people on the interweb looking at FACTS being negative towards the univeristy we all hold dear. In-freaking-credible…. when will someone, anyone wake up and stop this distruction of a once proud university?

    ps – Please note, I feel none of this applies to TOB. I see him as the one bright point in the department. That is the only area I truly expect to see results in anytime soon….

    Also, I again would like to thank this blog for providing research and information of this sort for the rest of us. Keep up the great work!

  7. Wulfpack 05/21/2008 at 6:50 AM #

    I would like to see the same set of statistics for the previous two AD’s tenures. I have no idea what to expect, but it would serve as an objective starting point to see either a) just how far we have fallen off or b) just how long we have stunk. In no way am I asking for any defense of LF. This record across the board, quite frankly, is abominable.

  8. CaptainCraptacular 05/21/2008 at 7:04 AM #

    manufactured substances here I come.

  9. PackMan97 05/21/2008 at 7:09 AM #

    I choose to look at these statistics in a positive light.

    I’m positive we suck.

  10. Rick 05/21/2008 at 7:25 AM #

    Wow are we the suck or what?

  11. choppack1 05/21/2008 at 7:25 AM #

    Thanks WV wolf – I figured there was a rational explanation.

    Wulfpack – I was hoping he’d have that readily available too but I can’t quibble w/ what represents excellent research just to accumulate these #s. Maybe a college student can get them – because no way in heck I can do that kind of research today.

    Here’s a thought – maybe our athetic department would have them. I’m sure that will fly over really well – “You see, I’m doing this research for a blog.” “Well, sir, we can’t just give this information away, you need to fill out this request form, then someone from our department will get in touch w/ you.” “When can I expect to hear back?” “Probably 4 to 6 weeks, but I can’t say for sure.”

  12. roandaddy 05/21/2008 at 7:55 AM #

    What about the bass fishing National Championship?!?!?

  13. Pack84 05/21/2008 at 8:12 AM #

    Can someone send this article to Dr. O with a simple question? Please explain how Lee Fouler was nominated for an “excellence” award. Seems to me this award must be about as meaningful as the ones they give out to every kid that participated in Little League this year.

  14. Noah 05/21/2008 at 8:19 AM #

    We are the LA Clippers of the ACC.

    Donald Sterling realized long ago that the NBA was strong enough that if he just fielded a team, he could make plenty of money off the shared revenue from NBA properties and never have to worry about actually building anything of his own.

    Likewise, Lee Fowler is just resting on the coattails of the ACC. Why bother firing coaches and wasting time looking for real talent? Just sit back and be the doormat of the league and enjoy the fruits of THEIR labor.

    And the other ACC schools don’t care. Go back and look at what UNC and Dook and Wake achieved from 1950 to 1990. UNC won two national titles and 10 ACC titles. Dook went to some final fours, Wake would be good once a decade or so. NCSU was right there with UNC, winning 10 titles and two national titles.

    Valvano leaves and we de-emphasized basketball. All of a sudden, the other big four schools all took pretty substantial steps forward. Seriously, if the “personal fouls” era never happens, does anyone think that Donald Williams and Rodney Rogers DONT end up in Raleigh? (Jamie Watson also ends up here, most likely).

    If that happens, suddenly Wake isn’t as good. UNC doesn’t win in 1993 without Williams. Dook suddenly would have two tougher games on their schedule and maybe another team in the ACC tournament to contend with. Maybe their seed drops one or two spots and their two national titles are suddenly in jeopardy.

    Even if Valvano still gets sick, retires and ultimately dies…he hands the program off in a smooth transition and this is one of the best jobs in the country. We’re still a major factor in the ACC and we’re still drawing talent away from all of the other programs.

    But none of that happened and the rest of the league was the beneficiary of our absence. NCSU becoming a non-factor in athletics has been a big help to the ACC, so they’re happy to string us along. And we’ve got the perfect AD for this position. We’ve got a guy who knows his limitations. He’s perfectly aware of his mediocrity. He knows that if he fires coaches and tries to hire a replacement that he will be exposed. So, he gives them the longest leash in the world and tells everyone that really what they’re seeing is PATIENCE, and not someone to scared to crap or get off the proverbial pot.

  15. Classof89 05/21/2008 at 8:39 AM #

    That volleyball number is sort of mind-boggling…most schools with a record like that would have simply dropped the sport…I suspect we can’t do that because of Title IX compliance issues. I believe in giving new coaches the time to succeed, but if the new coach goes 0-fer in the ACC in her third season this fall, what conclusion can we have other than that it was another risky hire of a coach with no head coach experience that has failed.

    But on the other hand, is it any less mind boggling than Tarantini and Kerrigan allowed to continue despite 8-year ACC marks below .200? I understand Fowler’s position about no accountability until you get what you need to win, but I know that all three of these sports have the NCAA maximums in scholarship funding and the two soccer programs are about to move into a new on-campus facility. When will we see some accountability. Sure these aren’t high profile sports, but in my book, excellence in an athletics program is measured from top to bottom. When you are doing things the right way, all your teams are successful. Not only are we not successful, we aren’t clearing the much lower “don’t embarrass the school” threshold…

  16. choppack1 05/21/2008 at 9:00 AM #

    Noah- You’re wrong about Lee and patience w/ coaches. What he does is build them facilities – to put them in the best possible position to win. Once the facilities are in place – a 15 year evaulation period begins.

  17. Ed89 05/21/2008 at 9:14 AM #

    Very good post, Noah. I completely agree.

  18. PackerInRussia 05/21/2008 at 9:19 AM #

    “We need the right people “on the bus” – starting at the top”

    Oh, they’re on the bus. Unfortunately it is of the short variety.

  19. BJD95 05/21/2008 at 9:21 AM #

    Noah – Stackhouse, Williams, and McInnis grew up watching the V teams, and had a pact of sorts to go to State together and win a national title. Then came Les Robinson.

    Very depressing indeed.

    That said, it’s less “if Personal Fouls never happened” than “if NC State didn’t roll over and play dead after Personal Fouls happened.”

  20. choppack1 05/21/2008 at 10:02 AM #

    Geez BJD – thanks for ruining my day. Of course, I can think of worse things than not having Jeff McGinness come to State.

  21. Ed89 05/21/2008 at 10:05 AM #

    ^^^^ Stackhouse, Williams, and McInnis grew up watching the V teams, and had a pact of sorts to go to State together and win a national title.

    Let’s hope John Wall, Lorenzo Brown and Derrick Favors make the same pact!!

  22. Noah 05/21/2008 at 10:12 AM #

    Let’s hope John Wall, Lorenzo Brown and Derrick Favors make the same pact!!

    I’m putting that one in the “I hope Natalie Portman sits on my face” wish-list.

    Favors is most likely headed to UGa or GIT for one year before going pro and Wall is most likely headed to a school not located in Raleigh, NC.

    I feel okay about Brown though.

  23. packbackr04 05/21/2008 at 10:44 AM #

    what about Phil taylor or Thomas Robinson? is either of them any good? i hear both of them are considering NCSU

    and im not sold on Natalie Portman either, did you see the cottage cheese thighs in “the Darjeeling limited”? yikes! id rather have Jessica Biel throw on some leather and start dripping hot wax all over… wait a second. where am i?

  24. packof81 05/21/2008 at 11:06 AM #

    Sounds like our athletics programs have hit bottom and started to dig.

  25. CStanley 05/21/2008 at 11:08 AM #

    Those stats make me want to vomit.

    Pathetic.

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