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After this year’s results combined with the twins “unexpected” departure I believe it was pretty unanimous around here that the trajectory of the basketball program had us trending towards a “trash bin inferno” in short order. Yow and/or Gottfried deserve credit for being pro-active and shaking things up in an effort to breathe life back into the program again.
They’ll get no “clown circus” bashing from me. Aside from cleaning house top to bottom (which reasonable folks should agree at this juncture would be more damaging to the program than helpful) this is the highest degree of action we could possibly take.
Whether it works or not is yet to be seen, but I for one am glad someone has acknowledged there were going to be big problems going forward. These are actions to be lauded, not ridiculed.
I think its great that both coaches recognize that a change was needed. I am just laughing at the circus type vibe of how NCSU tends to do things. In football our defense was horrible so lets fire the OC. In basketball we are going to let Lutz go to Gtech but wait something happened so lets create some fictitious job for him to hang around. Its the nature of how NCSU actually does things. We are littered with examples from the past 20 years.
Also to your “cleaning house top to bottom” comment. I have to think that more people may be open to this if the revenue sports continue to crap the bed the next two years. I could see a new AD followed by 2 new coaches in the 2018 time frame.
While my earlier post was admittedly a hypothetical created in my own so-called mind, I’m curious to hear why those who would not want him as an AD feel that way. I have no idea if he’d be good at it or not, thus I don’t have a strong opinion one way or another.
I will flip this around. Why do you think he would be a good AD? His entire career has centered around coaching basketball not learning the nuances of becoming an AD. I doubt its a position that you can learn in a couple of years especially in a p-5 conference. But that just reeks of something NCSU would probably do. Let him have the job because he is a “good guy”.
Dooley staying put. This is an absolute train wreck in slow motion folks. Hope everyone enjoys carnage. cue the local media about how we ran off Lutz
NC state athletics is a 3 ring circus from top to bottom.
I have absolutely no reason/sources to think this, but it occurred to me today…
Possible that Lutz is being “placed” in this position to eventually “grow into” the AD chair in a few years? If the man wanted to coach, he could at some level I’d think. If he doesn’t, I can’t imagine a long term “double secret probation” assistant to the assistant of the assistant gig is gonna satisfy him professionally in the long term.
I suppose time will tell. He might very well make a helluva AD, though…once he learns the ropes.
That truly would be the NC State way. Godalmighty
Seems like a temporary deal to me. I’m guessing that Lutz was effectively given his walking papers, either before or after the GT deal, but we are being nice until he finds a place to land.
Furthermore, I wonder if Joe Dooley isn’t looking at a position at NC State as a head-coach in waiting gig…
How the hell do you figure that? gott isnt getting hired by anyone else and in the unlikely scenario that he is canned in the next 2 years I seriously doubt that someone on his staff would be promoted.
today was just another strange day in Wolfpack Athletics. Simply no reason to create a fictitious position for Lutz.
I think if Dooley is hired then its locked in stone that Gott is here for at least 2 more years.
Lutz has tried like the devil to get another gig, but hasn’t been able to. It’s just been way too long (6 years since Charlotte let him go) and he is now 58.
06-07 Gott won just 7 SEC games and went to the NIT
07-08 17-16 overall, 5-11 SEC (just like our season this year)
08-09 Fired mid season at 12-7, 2-3
Bama had seen enough and saw a sinking ship. The character issues just made it easier to justify the firing of a guy that led you to five NCAA’s and an Elite 8 appearance five years earlier.
I see your point but he would have been fired mid season even if he was having a good year and went to the elite 8 the prior season. You cannot sleep with your star pg’s girlfriend, get caught (on tape) screwing a coed on the golf course and get away with it.
An assistant who is fired from a school along with the rest of the staff isn’t cause for concern.
A Head Coach fired in college for performance is. Gott’s situation at ‘Bama was complicated by off-court issues. However, it wasn’t a case like Bobby Petrino or Larry Eustachy where it was clearly off-court issues.
A successful college coach who goes pro, then doesn’t find success in the pros, and then returns to the college game is NOT cause for concern.
Lutz and Pierre have excellent resumes for assistant coaches. They would probably be solid hires for mid-major and below Head Coaches.
Not sure what you are talking about here but Gott got fired MID SEASON for off the court issues. Thats pretty much the exact same if not worse then the 2 coaches listed above. Mid season. That just doesnt happen unless you really fuccccccccccgggggggggggeedddddd up.
I would also argue about the “excellent resume” remark but I am too hungover right now.
So let’s get this right:
Abu told staff he was likely 2 and done.
Anya and Freeman are gone after this year as 4 year players
There are no other bigs on our roster.I still dont think its 100% we see both Anya and Freeman playing next year. Constant rumblings about Anya and these health issues/redshirt for Freeman seem to be picking up speed.
As for 2017-2018, that is a huge bullet point that people who do not care for Gott point to. We are looking at a catastrophic type season and if I recall correctly Yow pulled the plug on TOB pretty much for that exact same reason. Try and get ahead of the curve with a new coach.
For the first time in 44 years I will not watch the NCAA basketball championship game. I vowed before the tourney began that I would not watch those cheaters, I haven’t yet, and I won’t tonight.
Like I needed another reason to hate those f@ckers…
I think its going to be a great game. Both teams are playing well. Not sure I understand the “boycott” angle some have.
And I just think it’s not a foregone conclusion that they should have stayed when they were near guaranteed to play pro somewhere.
Especially considering Lacey already has his degree so…..I am pretty sure I read where he was 15 hours short. But was planning on returning to finish. But then again they all say that dont they.
Nothing significant is going to happen to unc. I think one would be foolish at this point to assume otherwise.
Sounds like Butch Pierre has joined the staff. According to Jeff Goodman, “top 5 most feared assistant by other guys in the business”
He also helped recruit 3-4 star center Gorjok Gak (any relation to Todd?), to Okla State. Gak has de-committed in the past few days and is re-opening his recruitment.
NOt sure what “most feared” means here. Recruiting maybe? But from a 30000 ft view and wiki it doesnt look like Pierre was a coach on too many good teams. Probably a too simplistic way to look at it but I am up for other methods.
Strange that my posts aren’t showing up.
Even stranger that the only one that does is the strange one.
Frankly, I’d be ok with firing Gott now. My only concern is who we would get to replace him. Would probably have to be lucky and pickup a young guy from a mid-major that could become the hall of famer we would want him to be. No sense in picking up anyones retread.
I dont think she fires Gott even with another season like this one. They are truly tied to the hip. Just this off season she was gushing about how awesome he was for the university and how he is making great strides in the program. Hence the ext/raise. And secondly I dont want her anywhere near another coaching search and I am pretty confident I am not alone in this.
Truly though, I think we will get a better read on where Yow stands on both DD and Gott during this round of caravans. I am sure the reports will trickle out about the q and a. No doubt she is going to get bombarded with the obvious questions and her answers will be telling. I predict the canned “bad luck injury, 4 out 5 ncaa, 2 16’s, every school has transfers etc” more of the sunshine blowing up our rears.
I think Gottfried’s done a lot to rub the loser stink off the program, in the first four years by (a) making it to the NCAA tournament four years in a row, which is not nothing for our program recently, (b) made the Sweet 16 in two of those years and (c) produced an ACC POY and NBA First round pick, in TJ Warren.
I don’t think Gottfried’s gonna build a contender, because of the roster turnover.
But I’ll “settle” for the results he’s had in the first four years, if that becomes the new normal here.The problems with that is I dont think he can ever get back to that. I sure as hell dont see a 4rth place finish the next two years and its looking more like middle of the pack (at best) next year. A lot and I mean a lot of things have to break our way to have a slightly above average year.
-DSJ has to be healthy and hit the ground running with no learning curve. (Frankly I dont see it, too tough to do)
– Torin has to be able to step in and produce in an ACC environment. (Sure I can see him being a touch above a role player)
-Freeman needs to get healthy (Not sure this will ever be the case)
– Abu has to come back (without ABU we are a dead man walking before the season starts
– TH has to bounce back from not playing in eternity and hopefully his ankle is healed (they seem to be funny once you get them operated on)Those are just the most obvious. Could all of those things go right for State, sure, but when has that type of stuff ever worked out for us?
Then there is the gorilla in the room 17-18 season which looks like a dumpster fire in the horizon.
Again I am certainly more jaded then your average fan but the above is pretty much what I see in regards to next year but if Abu decides to go then there are no words.
jesus…i just read the breakdown. i count 10 defections in 5 years [exclusive of decisions based on nba and family matters]. blame the kids wanting to be stars all you want . . .
There was some rumblings this weekend that the transfer train hasnt stopped yet. This is from some of my WPC friends. I almost want it to happen for the loller factor.
Chop,
1. I disagree with the “nosedive” assessment. If that’s indeed your opinion. A few days ago we had a solid roster. We lost 2 players unexpectedly and those are the breaks. There are obvious risks in recruiting twins but it’s Gotts job to patch those hole. But it’s been 3 days, you actually have to give him a chance to do his job.
2. This is a fair point. We had a great team with the big 4 and that was a season to forget. If we see that again I agree it would be cause for a move.
Solid roster? We are coming off a 13th place finish and just lost our all ACC guard. One pg on roster 2.5 (one chronically hurt, one with no ambition and one who may jet at the first hint of praise), bro we are a long way from having a solid roster.
Shouldn’t we expect Woodson to understand this?
No. You’ve strung a whole series of assumptions together to reach a conclusion. If it’s time for Woodson to do anything, it’s time to talk to DY about what she’s thinking/planning.
I honestly dont get the sense that he cares. He is probably looking at it from a 30,000 ft view and sees we went to a bowl game the past 2 years and ncaa the past four and is fine with that. I mean damn they just gave raises to everyone so what else are we to believe?
Instead of talking about Gott specifically, why should Yow not be fired this summer? The thinking seems to be:
(1) Starting point: Some say we need a coach now and others assume at the end of next year;
(2a) Yow is overly tied to Gott so she is unlikely to fire him;
(2b) Even if she weren’t, nobody wants her to be the one to lead a search;
(3) Therefore we cannot consider replacing our coach until the year Yow retires, or probably the year after since the new AD would otherwise have to fire Gott on his 1st day on the job.Shouldn’t we expect Woodson to understand this?
couple of points here. I have heard (maybe read) that Woodson wanted the entire AD upgraded and finishing better in the Directors Cup or whatever its called now. In theory Yow has done that so he has to be happy in that regard. Secondly he just gave her a raise and ext to 2019 and if you remember he ignorantly went totally around the search committee and hired her. That was one of the absolute classic State moves. Hire a firm to give you a list and then not even interview anyone from that list. I still contend to this day Gary Stokan should have been hired. Dude has a sensational business mind and that is what college athletics is now..a business. that ship has sailed.
Yow just gave Gott a raise through 2020. That is another classic State blunder. Absolutely positively no reason for that at all. Very shady. With that said he isnt going anywhere and neither is she. We will at best be a bubble team next year (still think its a train wreck season) and 2017 will be abysmal. No other way around it. So at best he is here for at least 2 more years.
Heres the thing that I dont get with Yow. She has talked up recruiting in regards to DD and TOB and how important it is and was one of the reasons she tried to fire Gary W. Well Gotts recruiting has taken a nose dive and any rival coach can show a recruit the lists of his prior classes and the absolute attrition that occurs and say something stinks in Raleigh why would you want to go there. No prospect or their parents are going sign up for that. I wouldnt let my kid certainly not. Yow has backed herself into a corner and it will be interesting to see how she tries to talk her way out of it.
I still to this day cannot believe we hired her. Just mind-boggling idiocy.
Wait a second an ad in the head coach are supposed to share the same agent / agency??
I think it is saying they shouldnt. Opens the door for some hanky panky/shady crap. (see Gott raise 2015)
Gott came with a history. To think that that his history wasn’t relevant was always more wishful thinking than sound logic.
What really pisses me off is that she didnt do any background checking or investigate what happened to his tenure at Bama. She just gave the snide “I dont need to do that I have known him since he was 18”
seriously WTF?
If there are 2 NBA ballers on this squad I’ll eat my hat. Abu is nowhere close to NBA material. Not shot, no handle, short, no chance.
Which is telling when a player jumps ship as soon as he can in this program.
If Gott has failed in any way, it is probably in the quality of the kids that he recruited. How many Gott defectors would you like to have back? How many showed promise but did not progress? How many thought they deserved more time and, in reality, did not? Save Purvis, I can’t think of one defector that I regret and I’m not sure that I regret Purvis (we still don’t know about Kyle). If we were having players leave and go on to be great at a comparable university, then okay. I haven’t seen it yet.
I would like to have them all back, to build a team, build chemistry, learn with one another.
Does it matter? This is why I called bs on the “lacy surprise.” Who cares? You know when excuses are valid – if you don’t make them every damn season.
With this departure, I can already hear the excuses now. It doesn’t matter – gott should be judged on his record…not given a pass when these surprises happen on consecutive years. He deserves a chance to coach this team next season – he should be fired if he misses the tournament. We should consider firing him if he doesn’t have better than 7 seed.
I think even the most avid gott supporters are livid at this. Clearly something is going on rather then the tired “lack of pt”.
