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Wolf … was that #1 or #2 ?
It’s a survey…. not an essay writing contest…#NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!Actually, You can call it a #4 as the Republicans did a good job of pointing out the evils of the Democrats, in the sense that they supported the Obama administration.
I don’t believe in voting for the lesser of two evils. Voting for evil doesn’t seem to work well.
the right is especially riled because they think Obama is destroying America or whatever
the left wing extremism of the President
the evils of the Democrats
I’m like a modern day oracle.
… and without going polemic…
po·lem·ic
p??lemik
noun
noun: polemic; plural noun: polemicsA strong verbal or written attack on someone or something.
“his polemic against the cultural relativism of the sixties”
synonyms: diatribe, invective, rant, tirade, broadside, attack, harangue, condemnation, criticism, stricture, admonition, rebuke;—————————
Ha! well that lasted one day…
The strong point here is that Voting is an Emotional action…. and regardless of how it gets ‘explained’… All the logic and reason and facts in the world don’t negate the Emotions of voting one bit.
#NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!^ WOW, that is probably the best description I’ve heard over the last two days about what ACTUALLY happened. Way to go wolfanatic!
Smarter than the average bear
Well, as a native of NC, but now living outside and damned glad I do because of the screwed up politics in NC, let me give you my view:
1. One party system in NC, yep the Dem’s and the Yellow Dogs will vote for Dems no matter what the policy, what makes sense, etc.
2. A second party gains control once every gazillion years and tries to “overcome”. They are wrong to “overcome so fast” because they know their time is limited…i.e. “the Yellow Dogs” will gain control again so make “hay while the sun shines” or something like that..
3. NC is now a blue state and all of the pundits finally get it…you’ve been sucked North to Maryland and Virginia and probably rightfully so…
But you moan and groan about how the Heels have dominated the state and the ACC, but you roll over and take it in the backside! But if you say anything about the “fraud on the hill” as relates to politics, you shout the messenger down because “no politics are allowed to be discussed”..
Sticking your head in the sand and refusing to “discuss” is the reason that my native state is…………and you can insert what your feeling is…Right now, I’d say “the leaders of both parties are horrible”…You guys actually thought Pat was a “conservative”? Did you not pay attention to Charlotte politics??
I hope you can get it fixed up there…I’d love to retire to the NC mountains, but not with the politics and tax system in NC!
"Whomp 'em, Up, Side the Head"!
Well,
While this forum is still UP, I will add my $0.02 worth….
Here is an interesting site…..since the topic is E>X>I>T P>O>L>L…..
http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/elections/2014/us/exit-polls
I believe that there is only ONE official EXIT POLL….unless the networks fund their own. This poll is what the POOL uses. Maybe wrong, but my son was able to “tap in” as he was a highly ranked volunteer in a national and state election and they gave him the “password”. That was the year that Bush defeated Kerry, despite what the “leaked” polling data would indicate. That was ALSO when there appeared to be some skullduggery and bias in the media. THANK GOD THERE IS NONE NOW.Anyway, go to the site. Compare NC to VA. MOST of the polling questions are the same, but about 25% are focused on the dynamics of the state. Look at the age and $$ demographics…..in BOTH NC and VA, the over 50 crowd supported the Republican candidates. MOST attribute that to the cutting of $716 Billion from Medicare to “fund” the ACA or ObamaCare. Obviously, despite the AARP propaganda, many seniors see through the sham. A LOT of Seniors were also on Medicare Advantage and liked the program. It was a Bush era program and sorely disliked by the opposition….so killing it was another objective and point of contention.
What is interesting in VA is the $$ demo’s. The LOWER incomes and the HIGHER ($200K) voted for Warner (D – Incumbent). Wonder how THAT squares with the President’s theme in his speech on Wednesday when he talked about MORE Re-Distribution of Wealth. Factoid, I THINK, the average Democratic congress person has a much higher net worth that the average Republican. HMMMM….nothing wrong with that and nothing to see…..MOVE along.
To add a little “fuel” to this discussion, the VA exit poll asked…”do you or any member of your household own a GUN?” God FORBID….in VA, it is 50%. That question was NOT on the NC exit poll.
I concluded from the election that we have a very IRRITATED (perhaps Paranoid) President. His “Relevancy” was severely damaged when all the Democratic candidates disowned him. The Grimes lady in KY and her “Did I VOTE for Obama” rambling, but NEVER answered, question went viral. One WOULD expect a KY Democratic Delegate to the 2012 (maybe 2008 also) Democratic National Convention to VOTE FOR and SUPPORT the party’s candidate.
What worries me is that Mr. “LOOK at ME….I’m RELEVANT, again” seems to want to punish BOTH parties. He has to re-establish his position as HEAD of the party. SO, to convince them that betraying him and making hi IRRELEVANT, he has to lash out at the opposition and then do things to continue to attract attention…..
And the LOSER is the United States of America. BOTH Democratic and Republican “pundits” privately and publicly have stated that if you think NIXON had mental and emotional and personality ISSUES, you ain’t seen NOTHING YET as to what he will do in the last two years.
SO, that is what I think…..meanwhile, WFU is playing great against CU….and CU lucked into the only TD they have…I seriously DOUBT that CU’s 24 straight defeats of NON-Ranked teams will fall tonight, but I am going to watch. Dabo will blister the walls of the locker room at BB&T field tonight.
Wolfantic,
I assume that BOTB means Best Of The BEST…..so, thanks, I think….
Back to the game…..tied….WFU has been “lucky” and Clemson got one “freebie” TD. It is actually an interesting BG…..if WFU can hold their poise….who knows….
BTW,
Do you need my home address to ship me the case of Crown Black as the prize?Actually, the Crown Black is just a parting gift, but if you’ll accept it as the grand prize, then yeah…you’re in..
Wonder how THAT squares with the President’s theme in his speech on Wednesday when he talked about MORE Re-Distribution of Wealth.
Would you do me a solid, and quote the part of the presidents comments you think says anything like that?
http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2014/11/05/remarks-president-press-conference
This is relevant to my interests, and I would like to subscribe to your newsletter.
PakFanistan….Here you go….space was limited so these are two that might suffice.
NOW, I have ONE question….which I asked before and just assumed that you MISSED. I have been a student of political history and trivia for a LONG time.
I can NOT find a reference or the speech or the comment that you have as your TAG LINE. Just WHERE, WHEN, WHY, etc. did an esteemed Republican make the “Ten Dollar” remark. You have quoted it several times and it’s format has changed at least twice….
Since I provided you with the answers to you question….perhaps you can reciprocate and provide me some web reference or perhaps an explanation of the Lincoln Quote….
Thanks….here goes….
All of us, in both parties, have a responsibility to address that sentiment. Still, as President, I have a unique responsibility to try and make this town work. So, to everyone who voted, I want you to know that I hear you. To the two-thirds of voters who chose not to participate in the process yesterday, I hear you, too. All of us have to give more Americans a reason to feel like the ground is stable beneath their feet, that the future is secure, that there’s a path for young people to succeed, and that folks here in Washington are concerned about them. So I plan on spending every moment of the next two-plus years doing my job the best I can to keep this country safe and to make sure that more Americans share in its prosperity.
Remarks by the President in a Press Conference – Nov 5, 2014
And the result is an economy that’s become profoundly unequal, and families that are more insecure. I’ll just give you a few statistics. Since 1979, when I graduated from high school, our productivity is up by more than 90 percent, but the income of the typical family has increased by less than eight percent. Since 1979, our economy has more than doubled in size, but most of that growth has flowed to a fortunate few.
The top 10 percent no longer takes in one-third of our income — it now takes half. Whereas in the past, the average CEO made about 20 to 30 times the income of the average worker, today’s CEO now makes 273 times more. And meanwhile, a family in the top 1 percent has a net worth 288 times higher than the typical family, which is a record for this country.
So the basic bargain at the heart of our economy has frayed. In fact, this trend towards growing inequality is not unique to America’s market economy. Across the developed world, inequality has increased. Some of you may have seen just last week, the Pope himself spoke about this at eloquent length. “How can it be,” he wrote, “that it is not a news item when an elderly homeless person dies of exposure, but it is news when the stock market loses two points?”
But this increasing inequality is most pronounced in our country, and it challenges the very essence of who we are as a people. Understand we’ve never begrudged success in America. We aspire to it. We admire folks who start new businesses, create jobs, and invent the products that enrich our lives. And we expect them to be rewarded handsomely for it. In fact, we’ve often accepted more income inequality than many other nations for one big reason — because we were convinced that America is a place where even if you’re born with nothing, with a little hard work you can improve your own situation over time and build something better to leave your kids. As Lincoln once said, “While we do not propose any war upon capital, we do wish to allow the humblest man an equal chance to get rich with everybody else.”
Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/12/obama-income-inequality-100662.html#ixzz3IM7I0c8R
@Mr. Stick… North Carolina has been a de-facto two party state since Reconstruction. Only thing that has changed, starting with Reagan/Helms/Martin is that the two parties were two different parties… You should catch up on a few things before you move back home… All the old yellow dogs you remember are dead now… and they’ve been replaced by Red Dogs and Blue Cats in some places and by Blue Dogs and Red Cats in other places…
@Beej… I’m with you on the quality of candidates / quality of discourse thing…
@ ‘Roo… Thanks for the link to the stats version of the exit poll…
I would point out that comparing NC and VA makes little sense as the Commonwealth is a deeply divided state of mind between 1965 and Washington DC and Military Minds in the Tidewater which in no ways compares to our battle between Raleigh/Charlotte and Perquimans/Madison County.
———————————Unfortunately… while most of that stuff in Roo’s link is top level stuff which tells us very little we didn’t already know… Most of those political stat guys don’t know the difference between correlation and causation and their reports are useless autopsies .. There was one thing there that’s worthy of comment…
73% of Mr. Tillis’s supporters think Immigration is the biggest problem facing the country.
Other stats show Mr. Tillis’s supporters to be strongly negative on other human rights issues.At the same time… ( IF church attendance is the best measure of the quality of one’s faith — which it IS NOT — the whole concept of measuring the quality of one’s faith is theological unsound, anti-biblical and judgmental for a wide variety of wrong reasons )… Mr. Tillis’s supporters appear to be more religious… more Christian than Ms. Hagan’s.
The perplexing paradox here is this…
How is it possible that the more “Christian” one is… the less tolerant that person is towards other people, especially people who are ‘different’ than themselves ???
More importantly… How is that possible when speaking of Groups of people ??? Is the safe conclusion here that…. “Religious people who call themselves Christian as a group are LESS Tolerant of other , more diverse people?? ”
Clearly the stats point us in that direction.
The best answer to this question might come from the ordained priesthood, instead of the political consultants… but I ain’t holding my breath on that.
This paradox between religiosity and human rights points us directly at #3 on the Bill On The Beach Exit Poll and all other answers are just vague, coded versions of the same…. or some people can’t or won’t tell themselves the truth…
Fact is … for some people … race is an issue.
Fact is … for some people… same sex marriage is an issue.
Fact is … for some people… immigration is an issue.
Fact is … for some people… Ms. Hagan being a woman … is an issue.
Fact is … for some people… Mr. Tillis being a man… is an issue.
Fact is … for some people… the fact that other people have “issues” … is an issue.Both pro and con …. when you add all that up… for most everybody that voted Tuesday… one of the their top two determining factors in how they voted was one of the above six “issues”… not the economy, not foreign policy, not the raping of the constitution by either party, not health care, not anything else… BUT something to do with Human Rights…
And most of them ( on both sides ) claimed a Christian or religious justification for doing so.
Fellas… that’s mucked up….
Now… the turnout was about 40% voting… that a good as you can do in the off year… So it is safe to say both sides got their people out… I’m sure that both sides would have done some things different….
I’m sure Ms. Hagan’s team is wishing they had run some ads telling everybody how good the economy is.. with unemployment at 6 in rural NC and gas below $3 — stock market way up… memories of 2008-09 fading for most… that might have made a difference with the 70% of Mr. Tillis’s supporters who are “severely worried about the economy”… IDK..
And if anyone thinks Mr. Tillis is not going to be a “yes man” just like Ms. Dole and Ms. Hagan…
Nevertheless.. the point is… at 40%… with a two percent margin of victory.. the election fairly represents the deep division between the people of North Carolina…
… a division encouraged and exacerbated by both clergy and politicians alike…
… a division a generation in the making which now has results in political gridlock, impacts the quality of candidates and affects the delivery of basic governmental services, jobs and the local economy.
… a division fundamentally grounded in fear and hate.
… a division not seen in North Carolina since Reconstruction.
… a division which “may” define the Future of North Carolina for the next generation.
North Carolina today… just ain’t the North Carolina it used to be… OR the North Carolina it should be.
And you can try to blame Obama for that … but it just won’t work…
———————Perhaps…. one of the subtle symbols of how divided North Carolina has become hits very close to home for most of us here at SFN.
North Carolina State University, a land grant college for all people, once a close knit community of a square mile or so….now sits on two large campuses… the old and the new…. a couple miles and several light years apart…
Maybe it’s time we all pray together…
…selah#NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!Click to access fs-112-2-191.pdf
My understanding is that Obamacare did not raid Medicare of 700B. If you have other sources I would like to see it. Facts always ruin it for everyone, huh Roo?
Like I have said many times before. I do not care how much the man (or woman) makes in the corner office. What I do care about is year that person gets a 10 to 15% percent raise while the average person across the company gets a 2 to 3 percent raise. 3% being the max. Very rarely meeting inflation rates. If you want to call that wealth re-distribution then I don’t get give a rats ass!
I DO NOT CARE IF THAT CEO MAKES 20M a year! Just quit growing the wage disparity. If you don’t think that’s a problem well then I can’t help you.
Bye middle class. Both parties are responsible for it
73% of Mr. Tillis’s supporters think Immigration is the biggest problem facing the country.
Other stats show Mr. Tillis’s supporters to be strongly negative on other human rights issuesSorry Mr. Bill but I do not see illegal immigration as a human rights issue but one of a legal issue. While there may be a negative impact on enforcement of immigration laws I revert to the very first progressive president, Teddy R. His stance was you are welcome to immigrate here as long as you do it legally AND you become a part of our society (i.e. learn the language, pay the taxes, do not be a burden to the rest of us). Today the mess that has been created by illegal immigration has become a tremendous burden on our economy and legal system. It is unfortunate that this involves people, and thus in the minds of some becomes that human rights issue, BUT illegal aliens, and they do know they are here illegally, have no LEGAL rights. Is that cold and unfeeling, maybe, but thems the rules, like or not.
Smarter than the average bear
4, 4, and 4. Historically, NC is fairly unique in that there was always room for local and state politicians to distance themselves from unattractive or unpopular national candidates/officials or policies. Heck, for a long time, there were even regional variations within the state parties, candidates, and electorate. That’s increasingly changing. In part, it reflects demographic changes in the state. The bulk of voters are single or double issue voters at most, and typically just voting for a team. Fodder for the discussion around the coffee or dinner table. Hofstadter’s classic, The Paranoid Style, is still as insightful as ever nearly a half century after it was written. Lots of fear mongering going on both sides of the aisle, just different fears. Typically, the national election can be cast into a simple question: what party or person can best manipulate those fears and manufacture votes? Identifying the fears of voters and driving those home is far more important than actually governing and advocating reform. That will virtually guarantee a loss.
PakFanistan….Here you go….space was limited so these are two that might suffice.
NOW, I have ONE question….which I asked before and just assumed that you MISSED. I have been a student of political history and trivia for a LONG time.
I can NOT find a reference or the speech or the comment that you have as your TAG LINE. Just WHERE, WHEN, WHY, etc. did an esteemed Republican make the “Ten Dollar” remark. You have quoted it several times and it’s format has changed at least twice….
I feel like I’ve already answered this. Ask Rick.
Since I provided you with the answers to you question….perhaps you can reciprocate and provide me some web reference or perhaps an explanation of the Lincoln Quote….
Thanks….here goes….
All of us, in both parties, have a responsibility to address that sentiment…
Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/12/obama-income-inequality-100662.html#ixzz3IM7I0c8R
That’s from last year. You said it was from Wednesday.
Like I have said many times before. I do not care how much the man (or woman) makes in the corner office.
Exactly. The issue is we were told a rising tide floats all boats, when very obviously it has not. All growth for the last 30+ years has gone to the top 10%
Awesome post, Bill. So much there, so little time to respond adequately.
I really have no confidence in the system. Both parties stink and the candidates leave a lot to be desired. Many are unremarkable people. Just have a lot of money.
And I don’t think it is a liberal thing to say you better pay teachers. More like common sense. We are basically screwed as we don’t value education.
And I don’t think it is a liberal thing to say you better pay teachers. More like common sense. We are basically screwed as we don’t value education.
The conservative argument against funding education is based on the fact that they believe the public school systems are liberal re-education camps.
One of the main reasons that income growth hasn’t been as equal as it was in the past is the loss of manufacturing jobs. Those jobs provided people whose education ended after high school, or perhaps a tech school, with the opportunity to earn a middle class wage and provide that kind of lifestyle for their families. The “service based economy” that we were told was so much better than the manufacturing economy has proven a disaster for lots of America.
The other reality that becomes obvious, if you think like an economist, is that the American factory worker on average was grossly overcompensated by the time the 1980’s and 1990’s rolled around. There are/were some inequities between countries due to HSE differences, but those only account for a portion of the difference. The short sighted nature of the US corporate management and the US labor unions in the 70’s and 80’s was largely to blame as well.
As for the “rising tide floats all boats” premise, boats that have holes in them, i.e. a lack of appropriate skills and/or knowledge, don’t float as well as other boats that are better equipped for the changes that have taken place in the economy. People have to constantly make sure that they have marketable skills today. They can’t just expect that somebody else is going to provide them with a job to match whatever skills they have.
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