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billotb,
If you know the Fugitive Poets then philosophically you know me.
I’m more in line with Donald Davidson than any of them.
McCallum
^So, a couple of decades ago, I’m standing out under the old tree in front of the little Presbyterian Church back home one Sunday after services and I’m talking to the new guy in town who just moved in with one of mills or CP&L, I don’t remember which…
We were the same age, more or less, and it turns out he’s a NCState Man.
After ten minutes, one of old Elders walks up and says “Bill, who’s your friend?”
I said… “Well… This is whateverhisnamewas — I just met him about ten minutes ago , but I’ve known him all our lives. We have were cut from the same bolt of cloth….”.
Truth is… this happened more than once.
#NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!Weather was cold last week, but this week start the big turn into Spring for most of Eastern North Carolina….
Time to check the oil and tires, fuel up and hook up…
If anybody would like to replace a few farm hands with their bankers…
Check this video out…
On Facebook…And yes McCallum…. this video would make RPWarren, DDavidson and the rest of the Agarians roll over in their graves or worse…
#NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!OK… so Basketball season is finally over and that’s supposed to mean it’s time to get busy in the fields…
BUT !!!
Tonight there’s big “Ring Around The Moon” which according to the old Farmers and Skywatchers means…
SNOW in Seven Days….
#NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!It’s in the forecast for Sunday. Hope my apple trees hold off on the blooms.
Smarter than the average bear
1″ of accumulated snow / 8tenths of rain in 7 hours Sunday morning down here at the beach….
Biggest snowflakes I’ve ever seen 1/2-1″..
would have been 5-6″ on the ground if the soil temps were hovering at 60*F…———-
We’ve got that mid-March colder than snot snap that some anticipated…
9hrs 32 and below tonight… last night wasn’t too bad, tomorrow night should be same as last night..
Everything tender is covered up tight…———-
Now I’ve got something for all you ‘real farmers and ag guys’…
I got a free load of local dirt to build some more test/demonstration raised beds…
ya’ll know what “free dirt” is… is that stuff that only holds the world together…
but I took it anyway because it was clean as a whistle and silty/clayey and down here in the sand — water retention and mineral content is nonexistent…it’s some second horizon tan/light yellow/gray stuff…
I’d seen something that looked the same on the Organic Vegetable Farm here two years ago and that was typical NC soil — pH about 5.5 with decent minerals…
But I got to tell ya… this was a big surprise…
23% silt / 77% sand / O% clay / 0.5 SOM
pH 7.6
CEC = 86
Ca = 32,500 lbs / Acre6
Mg = 500 lbs /Acre6
P2O5, K < 27 lbs /Acre6 each
B, Zn, Cu — all less than 1.5ppm
Fe = 92ppm
Mn – 14ppm
Na = 31ppm
S = 238ppmNo typos….
I called the Lab and verified the tests…
I’ve also been calling around, including back to the Homeland at NCSU AG, and I cannot find anybody in North Carolina who has ever seen a NATIVE to NC alkaline soil…
Holler back on that, if you will….
#NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!The “soil” could have come from top soil on fields that had municipal wastes applied.
If the material met 503 regulations as a lime stabilized material then that would account for the high pH and the Calcium being elevated.
BTW: municipal wastes are fine materials to use as a liming agent or fertilizer source. Different industries or cities meet federal and state criteria in different ways though all are legal, safe and regulated.
It would also be nice to know the amount you picked up, 8 ton load, pickup truck, 3 yard loader full, tater sack.
McCallum
Naw Mc… that ain’t it….
“Free Dirt” — this ain’t soil yet, but it’s my job to make it soil — came from a Martin Marietta dirt pit… it’s primarily used for construction around here as “fill dirt” because it will pack better than sand….
“Soil” has microbes…
“Free Dirt” just holds the world together…But you’re on to something….
The E Horizon is coquina, marl, limestone — whatever you call it down in JawJa — so the numbers would make some sense IF it had never been covered by alluvial acid soils from the ancient Appalachians as is the case in the Southeastern Coastal Plain from Virginia to Georgia….
#NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!No telling what you were given but just what county did it come out of bill?
On line soil map will take you from there.
And FYFI: I might live in Georgia, deal with their inability to stop at STOP signs, eat their rancid ham based BBQ, listen to how great the Dawgs are but I’m from the flint rock hills of the piedmont.
McCallum
Northeastern New Hanover… along the Northeast Cape Fear….
I’ve got that soil map… but it ain’t 100% right… this time…
which is why you do “soil testing”….#NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!What are they mining in that dirt pit? The high Calcium is odd? There are some alkaline soils in NC, mostly in the range from Salisbury to Hickory. If the organic matter was higher it looks like a spent mushroom soil, but that would have higher organic matter and phosphorous.
Now to using it to grow vegetables, you are going to have a large number of deficiency issues, the low P can easily be fixed with some manure. Due to the high Ca, it is going to take a lot of Potassium and magnesium to overcome that high calcium. (K, Ca, and Mg are taken up and act a little the same way, when you have one this high, even if the other two are in a sufficient range, they will not be taken up by the plant)
I personally would not use this in a garden. I think it is best used as fill.
Actually, the “Free Dirt” has excellent “Soil Physical Properties”…
a good balance of Drainage, Water Retention, Porosity/Permeability and Friablilty…
I’ve got all 82 Minerals and a bunch of Microbes I need in the warehouse…
Fixing “Soil Physical Properties” is not much discussed and is expensive, much more so, than Minerals and Microbes..
#NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!I’ve never seen an alkaline soil come back bill. Maybe from a deep hole?
Mac about 10 years ago Raleigh was so desperate to get rid of that stuff we got it delivered and dumped on the farm for free. We had it independently tested to make sure we weren’t agreeing to use something sketchy. If I remember right, it was a bit high in salts, but harmless every few years.
Better listen to wirogers on this one.
The only thing close to his love of Summer Erb is his knowledge of soils and fertility.
He did write a book years ago, “Best Hardees Franchises of North Carolina-A Journey from Beargrass to Salisbury” so he is a man of all seasons.
McCallum
23% silt / 77% sand / O% clay / 0.5 SOM
BotB, I am a grass guy, but you got to know soil to grow good grass. The high silt content makes this soil pretty useless for growing anything. Silt is the worst of all worlds…very poor drainage AND low nutrient holding capacity. I suspect the sand is also very fine. I’d keep this soil out of my garden, but since you are testing, it will be fun to find out.
I thought that was clear… they’re mining limestone…
USDA NOP regulations for Certified Organic Vegatable productions prohibit the use of any animal Manure withing 110 days of harvest, so unless you growing sweet taters or peanuts… can’t do that…
Significant amounts of the Ca is not available… On alkaline soils, you have to do a Saturated Paste Test to get the Available Now numbers…
Handling “P” is the tricky one… ya’ll already know that… HA!
I’m using Calphos, not Rock Phosphate and some MAP 11-51-0
USDA NOP regulations do allow MAP as long as the N lbs in the MAP is not more than 20% of the total N lbs for the crop…
USDA NOP regulations do not allow the use of Triple 0-47-0, which makes little sense to me in a long term plan… short term… I kinda get it… something to do with the residual acids in the Triple manufacturing process and not enough time for them to break down in that 110 day timeframe…
MAP is a little cheaper and that N ain’t gonna hurt a thing…
According to the numbers, I need 100lbs Acre/6 of Sulfur to get to 6.4…
And about 5% SOM… which I have plenty of…
Then the minerals in the right amounts should all do their thing… form Sulfates and Oxides mostly…
Then the Microbes digest those down into the minerals, amino acids, proteins, vitamins that healthy plants and healthy people need…Don’t forget to add Water…
Some HEAT would be nice too…
#NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!Bill, does the ‘dirt’ feel like talcum powder?
Looking back what I think you have is a sub soil known as saprolite or rotten rock. You find this around the areas of limestone deposits. We find this a lot in the Lancaster, Pa Limestone soils just above the good limestone soils.
Since your ability to apply mineral P in forms, the high calcium is going fix a lot of the P you apply as Calcium phosphates, making it not available to your plants. The other issues as you apply nitrogen sources containing ammonium your pH is going to drop, this will mineralize more of the Calcium and also tie up P naturally.
McCallum is just jealous that Summer Erb gave me the time of day and introduced me to many of her friends, he was stuck with Jack the drunk next to the bowling alley, can you say Hep C!!
McCallum is just jealous that Summer Erb gave me the time of day and introduced me to many of her friends, he was stuck with Jack the drunk next to the bowling alley, can you say Hep C!!
Hank the drunk, Hank.
I’ve never tested positive for Hep C though drinking after a Hillborough Street drunk (he was drinking King Cobra) was not the wisest thing I’ve done.
McCallum
*be honest. You are out drinking, having fun, telling jokes and Mitches is closing down. You’ve been foaming at the mouth looking at the chic from Cerro Gordo most of the night, Mitch is an a$$hole and tells you to get out.
You stumble down the steps, Hank yells at you to share a drink and offers you a brown paper bag.
Everyone one of you is a liar if you say you wouldn’t have done so.
wir… the “free dirt” feels like sandy clay — smooth and soft…
It will hold together when you make a ball out of it in your hand with a minimum amount of moisture… put that another way… it stays in good order about 90% of the time… that’s what got my attention to start with… workability and water retention… we had 3″ rain the other day and you coulda plowed it 24-36hrs after the rain stopped, but it’s stayed “wet” for 4-5 days now…
I’ve seen plenty of saporlite in the Northern Piedmont of North Carolina… saporlite is typically high Al and high Fe — I’m looking at Al=31ppm and Fe=92 ppm… saprolite ain’t 77%sand either…
But ‘concept’ is close — some ancient geological processes left a big hill of mixed decomposed limestone and sand which the Appalachian alluvial soils didn’t cover as deep as surrounding areas…
You right about handling P & Ca — there’s alot of intricate chemistries there….
I’m thinking MAP, but haven’t found any in 50lbs locally yet…——————–
RE: Hillsborough Street Tales…
The “Best” of those should only be told orally, not printed, and then only amongst the trustworthy of associates… My response to those has most always been….
“Sir, with all due respect… that’s was a long time ago and you’ve got me confused with someone else….”
#NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!Ya know, all of these elemental designations off of the Periodic Table with this weird % thingy and ppm units are liable to really confuse our tarhole lurkers (degree in ChE here)…they are probably killing themselves trying to decipher this code that ya’ll are speaking in and how it relates to investigating their massive cheating. Very informative thread BTW.
^I was at the CFSA annual meeting a couple years ago near RDU…
wearing my red cap with the Block S, of course…
The old State Ag Professor asked me what I got my Science degree in while at State….
I told him…
Political Science
then I told him ’bout my other major…
Finance and Marketing…
He smiled…
:>}#NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!Sir, with all due respect… that’s was a long time ago and you’ve got me confused with someone else….
BOTB, that has parallels to the 3 axioms for having a good time that I learned in the Navy but then sharing those is a face to face thing and I’m afraid I’ll never write them down just because “they” are always watching. Is it 1984 yet?
Smarter than the average bear
That’s field corn…
But three Springs ago it was 23*F on March 27-28 up and down I-95…
I’m not saying ya’ll Big Boys don’t know what you’re doing…. but you still you got to get it out of the ground, regardless of the weather…
——————–
Last year in New Hanover County, I planted sweet corn every two weeks from early March until 1st of June…
Didn’t get a stand until the 3rd planting… due to the fact that we had April in March and March in April…
Not that I had any input or responsibility, but my old bacca farm bosses used to feed treated corn to the hogs, we’d Q ’em, and I’m still alive.
Last year was a freakin’ disaster with the weather we had…So hot, blooms wouldn’t set, etc. Anyhow, I’ve been cooking up a bunch of “Kentucky Thoroughbred manure compost” all winter. Will see if there’s anything left in a couple of Keeneland race ponies!
Now… that was all UNTREATED seed, which was required by the “Organic” rules and regs…
There’s a reason why you don’t see “Organic” roasting ears in the grocery stores…
Also had something going on I’ve never seen… In places there was whole rows of Corn with female flowers and NO male flowers, and on each side both flowers… which ain’t too good….
Never did figure that out exactly, nor did my ‘experts’….
——————–Un-irrigated corn can be tricky in the best of years…. you got to get an inch of rain twice… when it just starts to tassel and ’bout 10-14 days later… the rest of the crop you have more flexibility….
If you don’t know how to farm, it don’t make a damn what’s on the bag!
"Whomp 'em, Up, Side the Head"!
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