- This topic has 152 replies, 34 voices, and was last updated 8 years, 7 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
h/t collegechalktalk.prestosports.com Today Mark Gottfried officially introduced Butch Pierre as his new assistant coach. Pierre previously was on Tra
[See the full post at: Gottfried tabs Pierre as new assistant coach]When I read the headline, “Russell Pierre” entered my mind.
This won’t end well, was the entirety of my thought.
Welcome aboard, Butch. Now go find a big man who is money from 8 feet in plz.This is a good hire. Both LSU and Oklahoma State had a lot of talent — so much that it made up for weak coaching (LSU got all the way to the Final Four). One has to think that a combination of Pierre and Early will be strong on the recruiting trail.
My question is whether this shores up anything with the on the bench coaching.
^ +1
But, maybe as important, can he heal the locker room. We not only need the DSJ types, but we need the bench players who are willing to stick around for 4 years to get their shot.
I think one of the downsides to the Martin twins getting early starts because of a short bench was that once they got the starts and the minutes they didn’t like the though of giving them up.
^
That is a very interesting take on the Martin twins. First I’ve heard anyone say that. Makes a lot of sense.As I read the opening remarks in the column, I had flash backs….
I think that was what Dick Baddour said about HIS BUTCH HIRE (OK, Dickie did not even go on the interview BOTBob Winston and the other UNX Rams Fat Cats did that and then celebrated at one of the Chicago Gentlemen’s Clubs)…..so I guess it was just a morning thing.
OUR Butch does seem like a good hire. He was, I believe, an “Associate” HBC and not just a mere, Assistant.
Tell him to bring all the decomitted OSU players with him. We CERTAINLY do need them. Hope he has a passport to continue Gott’s work in Europe.
ONE of the past posters (in one of the GOTT GOTTA GO veins) made a comment that Moxley was NOT the only “assistant” change in the works. Since Lutz is an Associate, that sort of narrows the field.
IS there any truth (other than being posted on the ‘Net) that Early may be searching for a new school color wardrobe.
Speaking of which, the Light Blue Shirt and Tie Index hit new highs this year….as did the lack of wins in close games. The correlation factor is obvious….but our coaches do not seem to understand that we, the RED and WHITE do not like to see them (or ourselves) in LIGHT BLUE….especially on the bench during a game.
Oh well….that will be lost in the hub-bub of HB2 and the hypocritical posture of the UNC Fans (who shut down Chapel Hill). The Gov should have issued a callout to the HB2 Protesters reminding THEM that the city of Houston, after a referendum recall vote, SOUNDLY (67 – 33%) overturned the Houston City Council’s own “equal pee opportunity” regulations. The Charlotte City Council passed the SAME regulation (patterned almost word for word) after the ILL FATED Houston law….but failed to include the “you wanna vote on it” clause.
Whilst we opine about Butch, the anti-HB2 crowd laments their fate as being assigned to live in NC….and
The UNC Crowd is under assault by the new Dan Kane “Stops the Presses” revelations…. with fresh (FOIA) news about UNC’s long standing 12 hour rule on Independent Studies. Meanwhile, Mr. McCants is NOW wondering if his 2005 studies were “proper”?
You gotta love this….will we finally realize that all of the above was NOT an April Fool’s joke….AND the same “Jokers” be around tomorrow?
PapaJohn,
Thanks for the discounts after 65 points….in all seriousness….at our Easter family get together, relatives from the Davie County area were there and the supposed “friends and family” of the Martin Twins had been abuzz with the news.
The Martin twins HS Coach (before they transferred) was NOT in the loop as to their exit plans.
The “close friends” also stated that the Martins were promised MORE PT, as a duo on the floor, than they got. So, they were miffed….outraged. They said that they did not get enough in their Freshman year and that this past year was “close to adequate”….but next year would be very LEAN.
It is NOT like the Boys were 5 star recruits. They were great, really good, role players. Each had matured, on the floor, this season and would be good bench and support for next year’s line-up’s.
NOT trying to defend (or condemn) GOTT, but remember that Jimmy V had a similar situation with Ernie Meyers. He COULD have told Whitt to “EARN” his way back into the line-up, but he did what he thought was the best thing for Whitt as a Senior and the team. He sat down with Meyers and explained that.
Ernie never really recovered or reached the level of stardom that he had displayed during his freshman year.
I certainly DO appreciate what the Martin twins did for us this year. I am very disappointed that their off court maturity did NOT match their on court level. I also wonder if (and when?….there ARE some academic issues with ONE of them) they ever quit bouncing the round ball and seek a career in the REAL world if they will demand of their employer that BOTH be hired and BOTH be promoted to advanced positions because as a “TEAM” they are synergistic.
They certainly do feed off each other, but not to the levels that reside in their mind. ORW learned a very valuable lesson about the Drew twins and he does NOT seem to go after genetic improbabilities anymore….OK, the TALL ONES….YES, just not TWO with identical DNA.
Beat will go on….
I find it somewhat incredible (not to say that I don’t believe it) that ANY player would believe that minutes were “Guaranteed”. No coach in his right mind is going to actually do that, regardless of what the “promises” were.
Are kids really dumb enough to believe that?
They’re 17 years old & they’ve dominated every game they’ve ever played in up to that point. Yes, some are going to believe the coach that promises guaranteed minutes.
^^
I’m assuming you mean the Wear twins, not the Drew twins…unless you are talking about Larry Drew II schizophrenic personality 🙂
FergusWolf,
Should have Googled that to test my brain. YES, the infamous Wear Twins of, I believe, West Coast fame.
I think that ORW had to use a LOT MORE of the stuff to cover your premature gray during that little escapade.
Thanks for the catch and correction…
The “close friends” also stated that the Martins were promised MORE PT
This us what I alluded to in an earlier post there had to be a reason we area seeing so many players leaving. To brush it off with ‘better players coming in’. Bring misled about playing time names sense.
^ Wow, that’s a hard one to bite. What the twin are effectively communicating to me (and I know, my brain doesn’t work right), is that they admit they are not as good as the other players, and are unwilling to work harder to get good enough to earn the playing time.
I always appreciated the twins effort on the court (if not always the result of that effort), but this I’m transferring because I’m not getting the promised playing time (because the other players are better)…urg
The pattern is still the same – we make unrealistic pledges to get commitments, and nobody ever makes personal sacrifices for the greater good (likely because they don’t see much of a light at the end of the tunnel).
So you have even more of a “me first, last, and always” mentality than exists even in the general population. Not f-ing good, peeps.
” Mislead” about playing time?
As a player, you know EXACTLY where your playing time fits in. You’re better than the next, or you ain’t. Period.
As a player, you know EXACTLY where your playing time fits in. You’re better than the next, or you ain’t. Period.
Coach just doesn’t recognize how good I am.
regarding the Wear Twins @ UNX:
1. they were homesick. sorry, it’s true.
2. Mama ruled their world. not ANY coach.
3. and you can guess the rest.CD,
HAVE fun….be careful….it’s spooky out there.
YES, I totally agree that OUR Butch is a positive move.
YES, you have to be mature enough to accept that there will always be a “Young GUN” trying to prove him (her?…..you never know…and with HB2, you might NOT know) self out there at HIGH NOON or at mid court.
In defense of the Martins, there is a special bond, obviously, with someone that looks like you, talks like you, moves like you, etc. And you DO feel a larger and more intense comfort zone when they are with you.
I noted several times this year, after Gott (and also the suggestion of the Twins) made Cody a starter that Caleb settled down and they were really good on the floor and took pressure off Cat. However, that, with the more talented team next year will NOT be the case.
Really hated to lose them….but like others, if you have emotionally (mentally) moved on, then it is time to get your sorry body in sync with your brain.
I did faithfully watch Purvis and Lewis this year and pulled for them….I guess, in another year or so, I will have a new team to adopt.
Roo: I’d ask that we stop with the Butch/Butch play on words with this thread. It implies that we’re knowingly hiring someone with a lot of baggage just as UNC did. It also implies a lot of shady things will happen in recruiting. Other than the same first name, the similarity seems to end there.
As for the question about the assistants don’t get caught up on the title. Assistant vs associate wasn’t meant to be implied. Also, if I’m the poster that you are referencing, if you go and look in that thread I clearly stated that I had no insider information on that one, and no sources. Just some rumblings and had pieced something together. We’ll see in the next couple of weeks whether it was right. I actually hope it was not.
As for the transfer pattern, there is something wrong with ours. I’ve hired a LOT of people in my career. Nobody bats 1.000 in doing so. If you have people leave for clear promotions, pay and titles that you cannot match (TJW and maybe Cat), then that’s almost a good thing because they’ve clearly developed. If you have the low performers leave (the last guy on the end of the bench who can’t ever get into a game), then that’s probably okay. It may even free up a spot (if you have all the head count and budget allocated) for someone higher performing to step in. If you have ones that leave for the first chance at more money (Lacey and Abu if he stays in the draft) then that begins to be an eye opener about the type of culture the leader is creating and whether people believe in it, the team, and the greater misson. If you have your main guys who get a lot of good opportunities and exposure leave for what are at best lateral moves (and given most NCAA transfers have to sit out, even leaving for a blue as an undergrad transfer would be at best lateral) then that’s where the expectations set when hiring simply were not correct.
Not all transfers are created equally, just as not all staff turnover should be viewed the same way. I hear the transfer stats trotted out as justification, but there are many types of transfers, so one has to look a little deeper. HWSNBN had a lot of transfers at State, but other than Wilkins all those that left were in category 2. Gott’s early departures have largely been in category 4, and that is a significant problem. There’s no nice way to spin it.
If you have ones that leave for the first chance at more money (Lacey and Abu if he stays in the draft) then that begins to be an eye opener about the type of culture the leader is creating and whether people believe in it, the team, and the greater misson.
I’m all about team and greater mission, but if the offer on the table is $100k vs $0, there might not be an I in team, but there is a me.
If you have ones that leave for the first chance at more money (Lacey and Abu if he stays in the draft) then that begins to be an eye opener about the type of culture the leader is creating and whether people believe in it, the team, and the greater misson.
I’m all about team and greater mission, but if the offer on the table is $100k vs $0, there might not be an I in team, but there is a me.
Amen Rye. If somebody is going to pay me six figures, c’ya. Got no problem with what Lacey did. Abu isn’t going first round – but if he was and I was him, I’d go too. Money talks to people who have never had any.
Communism is not love. Communism is a hammer which we use to crush the enemy. Mao Zedong
Fair point on pay for play. I would counter and say that men’s college basketball and football aren’t doing it for free or the love of the game. It’s not the same thing as a kid on a fractional scholarship to play field hockey.
I just checked and the current cost to attend NC State for a year is $38k for out of state. That’s tuition, room and board, books and about $2k in miscellaneous. The college athlete typically gets some sort of stipend while on the road. They get prize packs for attending bowls. There’s seemingly some walk around type money (which I think the Power 5 are looking to increase). There’s also medical care, insurance, the actual trips, etc..
My point is that while it may not be $100k, it’s not zero either. It’s probably conservatively around $45k for NC State and it’s more like $75k for Duke.
So, are they doubling their salary to play ball? Sure, one could absolutely look at it that way. One could also look at it like they’re giving up the chance to break out and parlay that $55k opportunity cost into +$1M that comes for further exposure of another year.
That’s the case with Lacey. He made the decision that he felt was right for him. I don’t think this year’s draft is nearly as deep, and I suspect had he put up similar numbers, he’d have probably been drafted. Maybe he would or maybe he wouldn’t, we’ll never know. He felt that he wouldn’t though, so he voluntarily gave up the year.
Part of that is up to the players, but part of that is on the coaches. If the players believe they’ll actually develop and get more exposure, then that $55k opportunity cost seems worth it. Our players seemingly don’t have that belief (though I hope for all parties that Abu does).
That’s why you have to look at the whole picture. If all the early departures are category 1 (NBA bound) and category 2 (GPA guys on the bench), then category 3 (left early at the first sign of dollars) are probably ones that just didn’t evaluate correctly. When you have a lot of category 4s (big minute guys leaving for lateral moves), then one has to question the category 3s.
Long story short, the category 4 transfers are clearly holding the program back. The category 3 transfers are as well. When you have as many in these buckets as we do, one has to look internally to evaluate what is going on. It’s not all “those kids on my lawn,” the culture of NCAA basketball, AAU, Handlers, etc.. There’s another common denominator there, and one that makes a lot more sense.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
