Don’t Get Too Down on the Pack Because You Were Too High on the Pack

11-12 Basketball Mark Gottfried NCS Basketball101

Yes, I know. Very clunky and convoluted title. Couldn’t make it any prettier.

Simply put, State got its ass kicked tonight. Why? They played a consensus pre-season Top Five team. On the road. Playing their very best (especially on defense and the glass). It happens.

Prior to tonight, NC State largely took care of business, winning 4 of 5 ACC games, all against foes that have no realistic chance of an NCAA bid. Now, that’s nothing to sneeze at – huge progress from Wolfpack squads of recent vintage. But by no means did it give you any rational reason to EXPECT (not hope for) a win tonight. Certainly not under the aforementioned circumstances.

Losing the hardest game on your schedule doesn’t mean you suck. Even losing it in such clusterfuck fashion. It does mean you know you will need your best effort to beat Virginia on Sunday. Coasting on positive press clippings won’t get it done.

The first step is gaining relevance. Relevance does NOT mean that you’ve arrived. That takes time and sustained effort. And frankly, more talent.

There’s lots of basketball left. And we will no doubt have other bad games. It’s still a far sight from the bottomless pit of despair in which we’ve dwelled for so long.

About BJD95

1995 NC State graduate, sufferer of Les and MOC during my entire student tenure. An equal-opportunity objective critic and analyst of Wolfpack sports.

11-12 Basketball Mark Gottfried NCS Basketball

101 Responses to Don’t Get Too Down on the Pack Because You Were Too High on the Pack

  1. mak4dpak 01/27/2012 at 4:31 AM #

    Again, this is just one game in a long season, and after watching State play, we all know that we are certainly a better team than what we showed, still trying to escape the Sid mentality. I say the coach will have us back on track, and the payback game in Raleigh will be much different, but for now lets just take care of UVA on Saturday nite.

  2. wolfonthehill 01/27/2012 at 6:28 AM #

    I didn’t mind losing… I didn’t even mind losing by 20… because it’s what I fully expected. There was about a 2% chance that we even make this one a close game.

    I DO mind what I saw from the Pack, especially offensively…
    * Calvin reverting to 2011 Calvin… selfish, and low-basketball-IQ plays across the board… and Gott never benched him for it. Highly disconcerting.
    * We actually got a LOT of bounces last night… four banked 3’s by my count (including the buzzer-beater), meaning that over 20% of our points came off of bad shots that went in anyway… and we still lost by 20. So we really should’ve taken a 30-point drubbing.
    * Complete inability to execute anything at the offensive end. The next high screen we set for Wood at the arc will be the first… repeated lazy passes to the top of the key that resulted in highly predictable turnovers… zero crisp movement on offense, which made uncch’s defensive task quite pedestrian… and seriously, I would be that we had between 8 and 12 airballs if you count anything that doesn’t hit the rim.

    Maybe just like uncch’s performance @ FSU and we just write it off as “one of those games”? Problem is, that makes two of them for us in 6 games… so on pace for 5 WTF losses, plus losses to good teams when we play well.

  3. tuckerdorm1983 01/27/2012 at 6:56 AM #

    they can’t dwell on it. UVA is a must win at home if we are going dancing. At the beginning of the year I had us going to New York in the NIT. Anything above that is gravy. I never expected us to win, but I hoped that we would have played better. At least we didn’t lose by more then 20 pts.

  4. Howler 01/27/2012 at 7:01 AM #

    We played against an NBA front line, playing at their absolute best, without any NBA quality bigs of our own, and we saw what happened. This season is all about positioning ourselves for the next several seasons with the recruits coming in, and we shouldn’t lose sight of that. In the meantime, I plan to take pleasure in the strides Gottfried is making this year. Remember, he is playing with Sid’s team, plus Alex Johnson, minus Harrow. His overall coaching grade should still be a solid A- to this point. (A loss to Virginia would slip him down to a B in my opinion).

  5. ADVENTUROO 01/27/2012 at 7:13 AM #

    Great post. Consensus of the posters have it right. In order to be 11 – 5, we need to take care of business with UVA. They are inconsistent and it will be a home game. We need to treat it as a Must Win, which is how we need to treat every game. We also need to “steal” one from UNC, FSU or Duke in order to get the 11 – 5. An 11 – 5 would also put us in the top 4 tier and avoid the “first round” game at the ACC Tourney. It can be done and the process needs to start at today’s practice. The team has a lot of potential and has shown a lot of heart. We need to invoke Jimmy V.’s 24 hours of mourning and get on with the season. V was noted for getting back to Reynolds after a local BAD road loss and telling the lads to “Lace em up….” and have a practice that lasted until the wee hours of the morning. Wonder if Coach G. thought about that last night?

  6. PackerInRussia 01/27/2012 at 7:28 AM #

    So, help me out. This was only the second game I saw this season. First was against Indiana. I caught the last few minutes of UMD, but didn’t know it was gonna be on, so I missed it. I’ve read a lot of positive things about the progress of the team this year compared to the past years and I believe it. Last night reminded me of last year’s team. Maybe there was a little more organization to it. Gottfried said that they weren’t playing the way they were supposed to after the first half.
    So, MY QUESTION: Was the way they played a departure from the supposed new and improved way they’ve been playing or was that normal for this season except more shots normally fall and UNC just happened to hit a high percentage.

    If they just had an “oops-I-crapped-my-pants” moment, that’s fine and understandable. Even expected this year, especially against a good team playing well. The big question going into the game was, was the record of 4-1 completely the result of an easy sked or not. If this was how they’ve been playing minus some shots that normally fall, then I expect them to lose to any good team. If you tell me that this was a one- (or two now) game aberration, I’ll feel much better.

  7. Rick 01/27/2012 at 8:08 AM #

    “You can rationalize it all you want . . . but getting our asses kicked by UNC on national TV is simply not acceptable.”

    I am constantly amazed how people can read what they want, not want is actually written.

  8. jbpackfan 01/27/2012 at 8:09 AM #

    Nice post BJD. I figured we’d compete, but lose by 15. Zeller and Henson make UNC a terrible matchup for us. I did not expect State to be so rattled though. UVA is a bigger game for this State team- home game against an opponent it can beat. A win keeps State in the top 4 and in the NCAA mix.

  9. Plz2BStateFan 01/27/2012 at 8:17 AM #

    I cant get mad anymore when losing to UNC in bball. Especially after the Lowe era. They are just always so damn good.

    Not worth getting worked up about.

  10. Wufpacker 01/27/2012 at 8:20 AM #

    @PIR,
    To me they appeared tight from the get go. They knew this was a big game and I think the came out overly hyped up. When things didn’t go as planned they began taking very poorly selected shots and forgot to block out on the boards. Except for short excerpts of games here and there this year, this was the first time I saw them with the deer in the headlights look for pretty much an entire game.

    Regarding V’s 24 hours of mourning, it’s too quick of a turnaround to the UVa game. They don’t have the luxury of 24 hours. Hopefully the coaching staff found a way to get them over it on the bus ride back to Raleigh last night.

  11. CaptainCraptacular 01/27/2012 at 8:28 AM #

    PIR not to worry, it is by far the worst game we’ve played all season. A complete loss of poise compounded by stupidity. UNC brought their A game, we brought our Short-Bus game for nearly the whole time. In every game but the GT game leading up to this, we have played about 30 minutes of good, smart, poised basketball, with 5 minutes in each half where we lose focus. We didn’t actually play badly vs GT, we totally outplayed them for about 25 minutes, they just were hitting miracle 3 after miracle 3 and everything they threw towards the basket went in. Tonite however it was 5 minutes of focused basketball and 35 minutes of ass tards running around.

    So I have hope that we’ll get it back together. Hopefully that will be against UVa but I have confidence we can go 3-0 against Wake, BC, and GT following that. 7-3 at the 10 game mark is totally doable.

    My venting at the blowout:
    Howell, as expected picked up his first foul during pre-game warmups. I mentioned in the forums a few days ago – I really wish Gott had started DeThaey and Painter and played TDT through the first TV timeout to absorb the one or two quick dumb fouls that usually frustrate Howell.

    Unfortunately last night, Howell gets frustrated after the very first foul, then compounds that by trying to do too much. Him and CJL both. Instead of playing an inside-out game where they would kick the ball out for an open 3, they tried to force it inside. After getting about 10 shots blocked in a row, Howell has lost it big time, picked up his 2nd and 3rd fouls in frustration, and Leslie starts trying to take everyone one-on-one. Stupid, stupid stupid stupid stupid.

    I was really disappointed that for 19 minutes of the first half, the rest of the guys didn’t do any ball screens or work patiently enough to get the ball to Wood at all. He took 2 shots the entire first half. Totally inexcusable. When he did get a screen or work to get himself open, the ball had already gone inside to the black hole for an ill-advised forced shot that was blocked by the Condors.

    I had hoped that Zo would do more taking his man off the dribble, driving into the lane to draw the bigs and either dish to howell/leslie for a few easy buckets or kicking it back out to GJW or Wood for an open look. I don’t recall that happening at all. We didn’t play to our strengths at all, and played to the Heels strengths, length and shot blocking.

    I’ll be expecting a completely different team/gameplan when the Heels visit Raleigh. If not, we’ll see you next year.

    Anyway, On to UVa — get your act together guys.

  12. StandUpAndHowl 01/27/2012 at 8:38 AM #

    Yep. Time to reassess, learn, and regroup for the next game.

  13. BJD95 01/27/2012 at 8:40 AM #

    Time to bring out good ol’ Occam’s Razor – Carolina whipped us because, simply put, they’re a shit ton better than us. Period, full stop.

    Pixie dust won’t close that gap overnight. Improved coaching and discipline helps, but only to a point. Luke DeCock stated it best this morning, when he said (paraphrased) there are only a small handful of teams capable of keeping up with UNC when they’re on, and NC State clearly isn’t one of them.

    Usually, there are several stops in between the outhouse and the penthouse. Such will be the case with NC State basketball.

  14. PackerInRussia 01/27/2012 at 8:40 AM #

    Thanks Wufpacker,
    I’m sure I won’t see them again till they play UNC again or Duke. It seems that’s the only time they are shown. So, hopefully I’ll get to see the new and improved version sometime.

  15. LRM 01/27/2012 at 8:45 AM #

    BJD, I don’t even know who you are anymore.

  16. howlie 01/27/2012 at 9:01 AM #

    I would say this loss can only be assessed by what happens in “part II’ as we play UVA on Saturday. Take it out on them, & the Ewe drubbing is okay.
    Lay another egg & it’s time to start discharging the chambers.

  17. GAWolf 01/27/2012 at 9:07 AM #

    Some national talking heads are saying we made a bad hire… those idiots don’t even realize we’re having the best year we’ve had in ages. For one, that speaks to how irrelevant we’ve been for way too long. They see one beat down at Chapel Hill and somehow deduce from that that we haven’t improved. That’s garbage. We’ve improved, clearly. But as Gottfried himself said, we have long way to go.

  18. patientwuf 01/27/2012 at 9:22 AM #

    “there are only a small handful of teams capable of keeping up with UNC when they’re on, and NC State clearly isn’t one of them. ”

    The absolute truth. Good post BJD.

    GA-“the national talkng heads” have never impressed with their knowledge of any sport. It’s all about the moment not the body of work.

  19. VaWolf82 01/27/2012 at 9:23 AM #

    Pixie dust won’t close that gap overnight. Improved coaching and discipline helps, but only to a point. Luke DeCock stated it best this morning, when he said (paraphrased) there are only a small handful of teams capable of keeping up with UNC when they’re on, and NC State clearly isn’t one of them.

    And anyone who thought differently simply wasn’t looking at State’s situation clearly. You take a bad team, subtract the leading scorer, starting PG, backup PG, ADD a new coach and that is not nearly enough to make State an ACC contender….regardless of how many times it was said on a message board.

  20. SqlWolf 01/27/2012 at 9:23 AM #

    “It’s still a far sight from the bottomless pit of despair in which we’ve dwelled for so long.”

    Seriously??!! I too expected a loss. But I am dismayed and embarrassed at how we lost the game. Is our set of players so “messed up in the head” that they can’t even stop, clear their heads and clamp down on their game to at least put together a decent set of possessions? I truly hope Coach Gott uses this opportunity to imprint on these players what it means to “bear down” and play like a team out there.

  21. newt 01/27/2012 at 9:27 AM #

    Would only add to BJD’s last comment that thanks to the fact Roy Williams holds a high school grudge, we will never sneak up on them again while he is the coach. They brought their A game.

    On top of that, we lost our poise as Gottfried said. CJ Leslie in particular has been horrible against UNC. How many times does he need to be rejected by Henson before he gets it?

  22. coach13 01/27/2012 at 9:27 AM #

    Disagree. If we were near the caliber of any decent team, we lose with UNC pulling away, they go from 9-10 pt lead to eventual 19. This was ass opposite. No D1 college team should beat us by 40 and had he not played his scrubs…ALOT, in the second half they could have, AT WILL, beat us by 40. Everyone is clamouring for Jefferson. We need to recruit legitimate bigs. I personally don’t understand why we have always used power fowards as centers. I know they are rare, but we looked like a bunch of friggin midgets, and if that’s what Duke and UNC are doing consistently, we better get the personel to compete or else go play in C-USA.

    I also have no problem with petitioning to play UNC only 1 time and Duke twice. I can take losing to them twice better. It’s the ONLY way we are going to even slow down this 17-1 run Roy has on us. UNC is an NBA combine and I really don’t give a rats arse if we ever play them again. This is not a rivalry. Its a sacrifice. We are the lambs.

  23. newt 01/27/2012 at 9:28 AM #

    VIRGINIA.

  24. Wufpacker 01/27/2012 at 9:30 AM #

    FWIW, CBSSports.com has their new RPI numbers out this morning. Last night moved us up to #51 (pvs #55 IIRC), with UVa one tick behind us at #52..

  25. Wulfpack 01/27/2012 at 9:31 AM #

    A couple of points that have not been raised:

    Quoting directly from the N&O:

    “The Tar Heels’ victory was their 11th consecutive in this series, and that stretch of supremacy is UNC’s longest over N.C. State since the formation of the ACC in 1953.

    Overall, the 11-game winning streak is the Heels’ longest over State (15-6, 4-2) since the Tar Heels (17-3, 4-1) won 11 consecutive between 1934 and 1938. UNC has now defeated the Wolfpack in 34 of the teams’ past 42 games, and Roy Williams improved to 17-1 against State as UNC’s head coach.”

    I guess that just about sums it up. Look, I didn’t expect Gott to be able to work magic overnight. This is going to be a process, and by all accounts I think we are making some headway.

    I was extremely impressed with Zeller and Henson. They are just on another level and do so many things well. Bullock also had a very solid game, and I thought Marshall got the better of Zo overall. Wood was a non-factor. That has to change. UVA is an excellent defensive team, so I hope we can get back in gear quickly for any hope for an NCAA bid.

    I readily admit I was guilty of thinking this team was better than it probably was. I’m thinking a lot of that has to do with the overall suckage of the ACC. Let’s face it, Wake, BC, Maryland, Miami – those are some really bad teams. And we got waxed by GT – the worst team in the league by far. So yes, caution should have been in order, and I screwed the pooch. My bad. Readjusting expectations.

    Still, get a win against UVA and we’re right in the mix with at least a chance (as others have said, we MUST beat FSU, Duke or UNC for this to happen). But a chance is all most of us want at this stage. It’s all gravy after that.

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