A closer look at the Ramsay case

UNC Scandal43

In this entry yesterday we talked about how UNC-CH has asked the NCAA for Devon Ramsay’s appeal to be delayed.  I thought given this development maybe a closer look at his case would be fun.  As alert readers will remember, Ramsay played in the first 4 games of this year before being ruled permanently ineligible for receiving “improper benefits,” which apparently were in the form of tutoring.  Specifically, he got a lot of help on at least one paper. 

This News and Observer article from last month gives us a look into the specifics of the matter.  Basically Sharon Lee, who is Ramsay’s mom, called the N & O and asked to be heard.  She explained to Tysiac in so many words her view that the NCAA punishment was draconian.  Apparently the News and Observer had access to the paper in question.  Anyway let’s take a look at some quotes from the N & O article.

Lee said her son and UNC officials have told her that UNC’s own academic honor system didn’t consider Ramsay’s issue serious enough to send to the student-run honor court for possible sanctions.

After that, Lee said, she thought her son would be cleared to return to the team. He had played in the first four games of the season but then had been held out since UNC discovered the questionable term paper.

Instead, she said, the NCAA reviewed his case and ruled he had received an impermissible benefit.

UNC announced Nov. 15 that the NCAA has banned Ramsay permanently.
So UNC-CH found no reason to even send Ramsay to their honor court but the NCAA saw the same facts and ruled him permanently ineligible?  Am I reading that right?  That is quite a disconnect.  You have to wonder if they are even looking at the same things.  Moving on, the N & O gives us some insight into the level of “help” Ramsay received from the tutor:

The majority of the paper returned to Ramsay contains only minor edits, but there are major differences between the paper Ramsay sent the tutor and the paper he received back. A three-sentence concluding paragraph is added, and the material in the opening paragraph is rearranged and expanded upon.

The other places where the paper returned to Ramsay differs from the one he sent the tutor:

Eight places where run-on sentences are split into two, plus a period added at the end of one paragraph.

Five places where commas are added.

Four places where word tenses are changed (for example, “affect” changed to “affecting”).

Four places where capital letters are made lower case.

Three cases where a word is dropped, added or changed to make Ramsay’s point clearer.

Three cases where a phrase is deleted, added or changed to make his point clearer.

So let’s recap.  In addition to rewriting his introduction and completely writing his conclusion, the tutor rewrote parts of six other sentences (changing words and phrases), corrected ten punctuation/capitalization errors, corrected the verb tenses in four sentences, and rewrote eight sentences into sixteen.  I don’t know about you, but that sounds like a hell of a lot of work done by the tutor rather than the student.  It sounds like almost a total rewrite.  AND UNC-CH didn’t think this warranted a trip to the honor system? WOW!  What do you have to do to get punished for cheating over there, seriously?
By the way, in case anyone thinks this is relevant, “plagiarism” is “presenting the words or ideas of another as one’s own.” 
So, back to yesterday’s news of the appeal.  What could possibly have happened to cause UNC to ask for a delay?  Well Michael McAdoo’s NCAA appeal was heard Tuesday, and we have yet to hear how that went.  Maybe something “came up” during the McAdoo appeal that gave UNC pause regarding Ramsay’s appeal.  Stay tuned. 
UNC Scandal

43 Responses to A closer look at the Ramsay case

  1. JeremyH 12/16/2010 at 11:56 AM #

    I think the people that are really in charge over there have forgotten UNC-CH is an academic institution, first.

  2. Prowling Woofie 12/16/2010 at 12:14 PM #

    Don’t blame Chancellor Thriller…he’s too busy groovin’ to the muzik to concern himself with academic integrity !

  3. primacyone 12/16/2010 at 12:14 PM #

    You don’t get permantly banned by the NCAA for cheating on a single paper. Just ask Cam Netwon.

    $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

    I’m just saying.

  4. STLPack01 12/16/2010 at 12:27 PM #

    I’m a college professor, and as much it pains me to say it, beyond the writing of the conclusion, there’s not much to see here. The other edits are just basic proofreading that I myself do for students if they ask. Now writing whole sentences, as the tutor did in the conclusion, is a real academic integrity issue, but not the other stuff. Let’s not be too petty.

  5. MatSci94 12/16/2010 at 12:29 PM #

    So what UNC is saying to its students is that having someone else rewrite your paper for you is ok under their honor system. I hope they don’t have any cases this past year where anyone was disciplined by the honor court for the same thing, not that anyone in the media will ask that question…

    What is strange to me is that (as I understand it) the NCAA bit on benefits is generally tied to $ amount, with the general scale going from 1-4 games over a $100 to $500 range, with more or less given based on other factors (Green at UGA got more because the person was an agent, the guy at Bama got less because they were truthful and proactive). In what has been released previously, the UNC players that were permanently ineligible received benefits in the several thousand dollar range.

    If the improper benefits were ‘tutoring services’, there is no way that could add up to ‘permanent ban’ levels for this paper (if it is, I’m in the wrong business)

    Is there something else going on? Did they find the tutoring service stretched over a long period of time (like, months)?

  6. Old MacDonald 12/16/2010 at 12:38 PM #

    STL: I would argue that those things go beyond “basic proofreading edits.” And writing the entire concluding paragraph and rewriting the intro is the most difficult part of any paper as you know.

    Assuming they are basic things, why the permanent ban? (rhetorically) I mean, the NCAA let Burney back on the field. Something else is up. Why do they need the delay?

  7. GoldenChain 12/16/2010 at 12:42 PM #

    STLPack, say I agree with you….then why in the world would unx-xh push for a delay in the appeal?
    If what was done was reasonable and customary then just show up and say so. The NCAA would respect that more than repeated delays to “build” a case for the kid wouldn’t they?

    I’m not a professor but I have my BS and two graduate diplomas and this is my opinion: when I get a traffic ticket (and I travel a LOT) I take it to an attorney who then works the system to alter the situation to one that would be sympathic to my ‘side’. That sounds like what is happening here.
    ….in my opinion (and I am the world’s formost expert on that!LOL)

  8. BJD95 12/16/2010 at 12:42 PM #

    Dudes…that looks exactly like one of my cats (JT). He’s never shredded newspaper like that, but he does with giftwrap.

    Yes, I’m a straight dude with multiple cats. Maybe that explains my “personality”, yes??

  9. wufpup76 12/16/2010 at 1:10 PM #

    ^Don’t feel bad … I love cats too. And I’m straight (not that there’s anything wrong with that).

    We all go to NC State.

    And I’ll bet this is Thorp’s favorite Chappelle’s Show clip below … It’s also eerily similar to their defense strategy so far:

  10. sbas2 12/16/2010 at 1:16 PM #

    what year was Ramsay. if what SFN quoted is correct, that is a large number of errors of grammar, punctuation, verbiage and subject/verb agreement for a college student-maybe even for a high school student.

  11. sbas2 12/16/2010 at 1:23 PM #

    that should have been: what year was Ramsay?

  12. Mike 12/16/2010 at 1:29 PM #

    I think the delay is pretty simple. UNX scheduled both McAdoo and Ramsay for their appeals. McAdoo had his appeal heard, and during the hearing, the UNX admin had way too many “oh crap” revelations. They were not prepared for the interview, thought it be a piece of cake and all would turn out fine. The “oh crap” moments made them realize the NCAA had done their homework and they better try to get more time to better prepare against the onslaught of questions.

  13. bradleyb123 12/16/2010 at 1:46 PM #

    An even more appropriate Chappelle’s Show clip is the one where he’s facing a panel of senators doing an inquiry, and he pleads “the fif”… awesome!

    http://video.yahoo.com/watch/6342252/16450688

    I’ve thought from the beginning that this is what BD sounds like when he says he “didn’t know”.

  14. Elrod 12/16/2010 at 1:47 PM #

    I have three different thoughts on the subject:

    1) Technically speaking, ‘how’ the paper was handled by the tutor and Ramsey breaks every rule in their guidance. The paper was e-mailed to the tutor, she worked directly on the document, she e-mailed it back to Ramsey and he turned in the final version. The entire process was non-compliant from the beginning.

    2) Several folks on the ‘nets have commented on their own grading experiences relative to this paper and its errors. For many of us, each of those pesky grammatical errors woould have cost us a letter grade before the professor ever got to grading content. This paper would have been an F after the first five errors. But 28? And they don’t even think this is worthy of review by the honor court? Ramsey should have been expelled for being dumb and the tutor fired for gross dereliction of duty.

    3) To describe this kind of paper as a draft, only in need of a little editing, is at least laughable. I literally struggle every day to find someone who can put together more than two words into a coherent sentence. We have coddled these kids for so long that they have no concept of real performance. I have absolutely no compassion for a COLLEGE student that can do no better than what is represented in this paper. Where are the students that can actually think and do? “To seem, rather than to be”. How appropriate.

  15. bigwolfpacker 12/16/2010 at 2:25 PM #

    I think they have done a lot of shady things over in CH but this isnt one of them. Im not sure how long the paper was, but if its a 5 or 6 page paper and she helped with the opening and closing paragraphs and some grammar mistakes, that sounds like what the tutur is supposed to be doing. Maybe she went a little too far but its far from a total rewrite as you state. Plenty of times I got help on a paper and suggestions were made or corrections made or sentences added to help out and I dont consider myself a cheater. Its part of the learning process and if he wrote the paper and then had help to perfect it here or there then I dont see the problem.

  16. packbackr04 12/16/2010 at 2:30 PM #

    everyone remember the SFN authors are just throwing back out there for conversation what was reported in the N&O. What has been reported might seem minor (and i can guarantee that is no coincidence. They are being very careful with what they release and know full well how it will be percieved) but it is just the tip of the iceberg to what has transpired.

    STL had the exact reaction they are hoping to get. “well, if thats all he did, whats the big deal. my professor helped me with that same type of stuff when i was in school! what a mean bunch, that NCAA. Let him play”…

    but be realistic,if the kid has 28 grammatical errors in one english paper you can imagine the help he needs in science class, in history, in math, etc, etc.

  17. STLPack01 12/16/2010 at 2:37 PM #

    @Old MacD

    That’s why I said that the writing of the conclusion is a serious academic issue. That should be looked into, and is probably worthy of said punishment.

    @Elrod

    Sadly, this is the state of many students in colleges these days. They cannot write a lick. If I am helping a student with a rough draft, I prefer them to send me an electronic copy which I mark up using MS Word’s “Review Changes” function. I can correct mistakes, make comments, etc. This is just normal editing. It’s not any different than what a book publisher or a journal editor would do (barring the prolific nature of the mistakes). What’s the tutor supposed to do? Give the paper back without pointing out the mistakes and say, “Sorry dude, you have to do better.” No, the tutor points out the mistakes and returns the paper, expecting the student to correct the mistakes and respond to the comments. This is how it’s done.

    Now, again, this is not to say that a tutor/professor/friend should be writing whole sentences. This is not ethical and should be looked into.

  18. rtpack24 12/16/2010 at 2:38 PM #

    If Ramsey had this many errors in one paper who cleans up the rest of his work?

  19. Old MacDonald 12/16/2010 at 2:50 PM #

    STL: I don’t think we disagree much.

    How did this cat get through his college English composition class? (Assuming he had to take one). I mean seriously, who got him through that?

  20. tjfoose1 12/16/2010 at 2:51 PM #

    Ramsay is a redshirt junior… think about that folks, let that sink in for a moment.

    A fourth year college student who has no grasp of basic punctuation, grammar, verb tense, and sentence structure – something most of us tamed, if not mastered, before leaving elementary school – a freakn FOURTH year COLLEGE student!

    Puts in perspective their graduation rates, not to mention the value of a UNC-CH degree. If this were a punch line, it might make for a mildly funny joke. But it’s not, this is reality of “the Carolina way”.

    Wow, just wow… and the admin found nothing wrong, nothing warranting an honor court hearing anyway? Really?

    How about just being embarrassed by the performance of a 4th year UNC student? We’ll never know, but I wonder what kind of grades this kid has… something tells me the term ‘inflated’ might be relevant, but anyway…

    I would not have believed the level of their depravity if… heck, I’m having difficulty believing it now.

    I have thoughts of all these cliches and metaphors running through my mind right now… but they do no justice to the reality of the true stench hovering due west of Raleigh.

    Another example of reality surpassing believable fiction.

  21. hoop 12/16/2010 at 2:54 PM #

    The guy is a friggin football player. Some of them are just not smart. I mean, this isn’t the Stanford football team we’re talking about here. It’s UNC football. To be perfectly honest with you, if he is working towards bettering his English skills, I’m ok with this level of involvement. Of course, that’s a big if.

    And I can’t believe the NCAA would permanently ban him for his tutor helping with his paper. Sounds like the UNC MisInformation Department is doing to the Ramsay report what they’ve done to all the other ‘information’ coming out of there.

  22. STLPack01 12/16/2010 at 2:58 PM #

    @ McD

    I’m guessing he’s had tutors and professors who have never taken the time to teach him to write. That’s one of the issues here: that by simply correcting the mistakes the student doesn’t learn. They must be forced, somehow, to make the corrections themselves. I’m not sure if the tutor used the MS Word “review changes” function, but if he/she did the student would be forced to cycle through each correction and see what he did wrong. I’ll be honest with you though, if a student is this bad, he probably does need to fail the course, but somebody did not do their job along the way. I wouldn’t call it cheating though. (Again excepting the whole sentences written by the tutor, which is cheating).

    What does it say about UNC? I suspect it says about UNC what it would say about any major college or university. Admission standards are pretty low, and students get shuffled through. These students expect to do little or nothing and get at least a B. They are very upset when they get a C or a D, even though they admit that they didn’t care and they didn’t try. I don’t know the root causes, but it seems to be the case everywhere from my conversations with other academics.

  23. tjfoose1 12/16/2010 at 3:03 PM #

    Football player, basketball player, Joe College student at UNC-CH, NC State, Stanford or Harvard.. doesn’t matter to me.

    The ‘quality’ of that kind of work is inexcusable coming from a 4th year university student, period.

    Just further commentary on PC, political agendas, and ‘fairness’, as it is defined by many in today’s society.

    I realize it is not the problem, but a mere symptom of a bigger problem in today’s…

    Oops, I’m veering way off topic. Apologies. I’m done now.

  24. tractor57 12/16/2010 at 3:29 PM #

    ‘foose you saved me from posting the same thing.

  25. fullmoon1 12/16/2010 at 4:53 PM #

    This issue is being used as the smoke. This is like the other things they have released that are violations but minor ones. I would like to see details from one of the other players ordeals that this is drawing attention away from.

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