NC State vs Georgia Tech Open Post

09-10 Basketball ACC College Basketball295

Will NC State start a bigger lineup against the inside oriented Jackets? Can the Wolfpack take down its third ranked oppoenent of the season?

Today’s game is huge for both State and Ga. Tech. Both needs win badly.

Post thoughts here and check Twitter during the game for a few updates/thoughts.

09-10 Basketball ACC College Basketball

295 Responses to NC State vs Georgia Tech Open Post

  1. Wulfpack 02/07/2010 at 3:56 PM #

    “They are not going to the NCAA tournament.”

    So you’re saying there is no way UVA gets 3 more wins to get to 8-8? Looking at their schedule, they should have an excellent chance against BC and Miami. They’d need one more, or one in the tournament. I’m not exactly certain how you can be so certain they aren’t going to make it at this stage. They’ve got the best player in the league and have fought tooth and nail with everyone they’ve played. Two of their losses are overtime losses, so they could just as easily have six wins now. I’d say there is a 50-50 chance they get a bid. You must really have something against them to be so certain they won’t be in the mix, because right now, they most certainly are.

  2. MA Wolfpack 02/07/2010 at 4:45 PM #

    UVA’s best win is GT at home. They have horrible losses.

    W&M at home
    Penn St at home
    Stanford at home
    @ Auburn
    @ USF (by 17 points)

    Their only opportunities for quality wins are @ MD, Duke and MD at home. I think they lose all 3 of those games. If they lose those 3, then I do not think they get in even at 9-7 (VaWolf’s opinion may differ). If they lose those 3, then they have to find 4 wins out of these games to get to 9-7.

    @ VT
    @ Clemson
    @ Miami
    @BC
    FSU

    Do you think that UVA team is going to win 3 road games and beat FSU at home? I think they have a better chance of losing all 5 than doing that.

  3. packplantpath 02/07/2010 at 5:07 PM #

    “Rochester, you are correct that the Mays/CJW recruiting class is killing us right now. Unfortunately, that is a sunk cost. Anyone making decisions based on sunk costs is an idiot.”

    Somebody above said this. God I hope they didn’t think this through. So, the past is irrelevant? Who sunk these costs again? Sure, Harrow/Brown make next year look better if you think talent is our only problem. But, we can’t simply treat every year as a blank slate.

  4. packfan03 02/07/2010 at 5:15 PM #

    Sidney is not incompetent –

    If we had Carolina’s roster and our record, then the argument can be made. Again, with the talent we have, it’s difficult to make an argument that Sid is lacking in the coaching department. Certainly, this time next year if we are still at the bottom the argument can be made. But honestly, it’s not even worthwhile now because our talent suggests our record should be what it is.

    Sidney can recruit, he just needed some time to get his contacts in order. Next year’s class reflects this.

  5. VaWolf82 02/07/2010 at 5:20 PM #

    Sidney is not incompetent –

    I wish that there was objective evidence to support this conclusion. But right now, this looks more like blind faith than a logical conclusion.

  6. packfan03 02/07/2010 at 5:20 PM #

    To clarify my opinion:

    Sidney may be a bad coach, but we won’t know until he has the talent to succeed.

    Sidney can recruit, and has proved to be a great talent evaluator. Ryan Harrow was a 3 star recruit when we began looking at him, now he’s a five star. I think you’ll see the same out of Joseph Uchebo, Jacob Lawson (potentially), and TJ Warren (potentially).

    The fact our program is in the running for top notch recruits in the next few years is enough for me, right now. If Sidney cannot coach the talent coming in next year, I will, as the immortal Philip Rivers so eloquently states, eat crow.

  7. packfan03 02/07/2010 at 5:24 PM #

    “I wish that there was objective evidence to support this conclusion. But right now, this looks more like blind faith than a logical conclusion.”

    VaWolf82, I completely understand and think it’s fair for you to have that perspective (not that my opinion of ‘fair’ matters, but nonetheless..).

    But, I also think it’s a bit illogical to state that he is incompetent. He’s likely somewhere in the middle. It’s just my opinion that we won’t know definitively one way or another until next year – as frustrating as that is. I also do NOT believe that the fact he was on the 83 team gives him more time to prove himself, as the announcers stated yesterday. He has a job, and is getting paid. I objectively (in my mind, for what it’s worth) have come to the conclusion that he should be the coach next year. From there, I’m open for discussion.

  8. Wulfpack 02/07/2010 at 5:29 PM #

    “But, I also think it’s a bit illogical to state that he is incompetent.”

    We now have 4 years of data supporting the claim. What’s “illogical” is for anyone to suggest otherwise, judging by the facts.

  9. JeremyH 02/07/2010 at 5:30 PM #

    “The fact our program is in the running for top notch recruits in the next few years is enough for me, right now.”

    In the running means nothing, we were in the running for Favors, Wall, and Leslie. We even *nabbed* Brown, but he’s not here right now.

  10. tuckerdorm1983 02/07/2010 at 5:32 PM #

    go heels!!! go where?? back home with your tail between your legs after a good ole fashion whupping by them twerps. maybe they stopped on the way back home at Mcdonalds with all their Mcdonalds all americans who are suppose to win all their games.

  11. JeremyH 02/07/2010 at 5:34 PM #

    but I will say this, having a top flight point guard (Lawson), a top flight shooting guard (Ellington), makes all the different in the world, which you realize when you are without them (UNC ’10). The scenario to aim for is that based on our “upgrades” at these key positions, the program will get more attention, or rather positive attention, and Lowe can keep this recruiting momentum going.

  12. Rochester 02/07/2010 at 5:42 PM #

    I’d love to see the list of coaches who finished in the bottom three in the ACC their first four years who went on to successful careers. I’m guessing it’s a short one.

    This whole conversation is hypothetical, because we all know Lowe won’t get fired this year. But I’m not optimistic we’ll have a winning ACC record a year from today. I just don’t want to hear any excuses if we don’t make the NCAAT in 2011. No “well, Harrow and Brown were only freshmen, be patient,” etc. Win or clean house next year.

  13. JeremyH 02/07/2010 at 5:45 PM #

    that’s why people don’t like WTNY, it infinitely repeats. sounds like you are proposing a WTNY*, a special WTNY.

  14. VaWolf82 02/07/2010 at 6:22 PM #

    But, I also think it’s a bit illogical to state that he is incompetent.

    So I guess you also think that using his coaching record to reach a conclusion would be illogical.

  15. wolfpack4ever 02/07/2010 at 8:50 PM #

    I (as most all true NC State alumni and fans) wanted Lowe to succeed. However, he has not. We have nothing that is dependable.

    Good defense NO!
    Good rebounding NO!
    Good outside shooting NO!
    Good free throw shooting NO!
    Good offensive scheme NO! It is near impossible to determine what our base offense is!
    Good coaching NO! NO! Good coaches can occasionally take an overmatched, undertalented team and win some games that they should not. It may be by a unique defensive strategy, match up substitutions or fouling strategy.
    We have seen little to no evidence of any of the above in four years.

    My only hope now is that our new Chancellor Randy Woodson meets with our interim Chancellor Woodward as soon as humanly possible. They are in agreement to offer our present imposter of an Athletic Director Lee Fowler the opportunity to retire gracefully or be fired. Upon the hiring of a competent AD, this person will utilize one season to fairly evaluate our basketball staff and compare their results to pre-determined, clearly defined objectives. This will allow the upcoming recruiting class (that a lot of posters stake our future to) to become NC State student athletes.

    I am confident, by that time, that our new chancellor and athletic director will determine that, while Sidney Lowe bleeds “NC State red” and “is one of us”, he is not capable of leading an NCAA basketball program to success. At that time, a well run coaching search will rapidly select from a list put together this spring, summer, fall that includes “A list, B list and C list” candidates.

    Time only, will tell us what the outcome will be. However, I will long admire Sidney Lowe for rescuing us from the fiasco that is Lee Fowler and his inept search skills. It is just so sad that this chapter of Wolfpack basketball has been but a continuation of the mediocrity of Les Robinson and Herb Sendek. I have been waiting for something extraordinary from NCSU sports and I will not be able to stomach the “WTNY” beyond next season. Mr. Woodward and Mr. Woodson please make this a proud institution again!! Go Pack!!!!!!

  16. packfan03 02/07/2010 at 9:50 PM #

    “So I guess you also think that using his coaching record to reach a conclusion would be illogical.”

    Zing!!!

    No. I think that anyone suggesting that he should have a winning record is using illogical rational. Talent wins. Period. If you think anyone would have a winning right now with our roster, you are insane. Roy? no. K? no. The Zen master? no. We just aren’t talented enough. Sid can recruit. I simply ask that you give him one more year…not that you say he is the chosen one.

  17. VaWolf82 02/07/2010 at 9:55 PM #

    Talent wins. Period. If you think anyone would have a winning right now with our roster, you are insane….Sid can recruit.

    Otherwise known as a self-defeating argument.

  18. tuckerdorm1983 02/07/2010 at 10:02 PM #

    vawolf82 AMEN BROTHER AMEN

  19. MA Wolfpack 02/07/2010 at 10:09 PM #

    Rochester, you are correct on next year’s expectations. NCSU will be in the NCAA tournament next year or Sid will be gone. He will have the players to compete next year….youth is a problem that is overcome by talent. If you can play, then you can play.

  20. MA Wolfpack 02/07/2010 at 10:14 PM #

    packplantpath, yes it is irrelevant to say Sid should be fired b/c of that recruiting class. If you wanted to fire Sid b/c of that recruiting class, then you should have done it at the time. It is not going to change or improve…it is what it is. NCSU’s decision should be made on what we believe will happen in the future, not what we cannot change. I think Harrow and Brown will change NCSU’s program.

  21. 66pack 02/07/2010 at 10:22 PM #

    statefano3 please take a course in logic.

  22. packfan03 02/07/2010 at 11:07 PM #

    66pack, please take a course in reading.

    Why it is hard for some of you to understand that an NBA coach needs time to setup recruiting connections is beyond me.

    Regardless of your opinion, Sidney isn’t going to be fired this year, so why not support the program? It simply makes sense to wait for the talent base coming in next year. Why bash it now? At least wait until next year so you have an actual argument.

  23. packfan03 02/07/2010 at 11:13 PM #

    “Otherwise known as a self-defeating argument.”

    Sneaky Snarky…I would appreciate this if I agreed with you. Obviously, if you read my posts you would understand that my logic is not unfounded. You may disagree, but it’s not ridiculous to think an NBA coach without recruiting contacts setup would need time before bringing in top notch talent. He’s bringing it in next year and we’ll have a verdict then.

    Blame Lee Fowler for hiring a guy that needed more time than most to get quality recruits, not the guy that is playing with the hand he was dealt.

  24. Wulfpack 02/08/2010 at 6:36 AM #

    “We just aren’t talented enough. Sid can recruit.”

    You’re talking out of two sides of your mouth here. Sid has done a poor job recruiting. He has done a poor job coaching the recruits he has brought in. He has amassed a very poor record, which is eerily similar to his record during his NBA days.

    A bunch of you guys are spouting out that Sid is a great recruiter. Somebody please show me the evidence ON THE FLOOR.

    He will get next year. And we can all look forward to WTNY arguments at this point next year. It’s a guarantee.

  25. JT 02/08/2010 at 10:45 AM #

    I think the big question still is whether Lowe can recruit. It does seem like the incoming class even w/o Leslie would fill the most serious gaps. If it does, can he keep it rolling and maintain a decent baseline talent level, avoiding those huge gaps in the lineup? My thiking is that next year will be better, and then the next class HAS TO BE very good. If not, after 6 years we should know he can’t recruit well enough. I think he can, or at least hope he can, but he has to prove it and it hasn’t been done thus far. There are flickers of life, but with the current lineup it’s impossible to tell what they mean. One thing he has worked against is the foundation of mediocrity Sendek laid in turning off recruits with the Princeton offense. That said, it is put up or shut up time, this class and next. And if this is a WTNY post, then fuck it- should I revel in the present or jump on the blow it up bandwagon? NO. Lowe has a chance…I just hope he can take it.

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