State can’t stay undefeated – can Farnold Degand get is *(#&$ together to help this team?

In relatively even match-ups on the hardwood, one can often point to a single statistic that makes a difference in a one-game battle. This pretty much describes NC State’s loss tonight at the RBC Center to the Northwestern Wildcats.

For the night, NC State shot a putrid 2 of 18 for 11% from the three-point line with Javi Gonzalez hitting the Wolfpack’s only two threes (2 of 6)

It doesn’t get any more simple than that.

The Wolfpack missed wide open looks…half contested looks…quick ball reversed looks…you name the look, the Wolfpack missed it.

Additionally, our (expected) weak guard play had a difficult time (1) creating opportunities for the offense against the Wildcat’s extended zone defense and (2) struggled to control Northwestern’s point guard, Michael Thompson who finished the night with 22 points and was able to easily create/convert drives for key buckets in the last five minutes of the game.

Tonight was a night when you could really see where Farnold Degand could help this team. His athleticism, length, quickness and shooting ability are all superior to those of Julius Mays. I love Julius Mays and appreciate his contributions to this team. But that doesn’t make my statement about Degand less true. Who knows the impact Degand could have had on both ends of the court if he was playing.

Boxscore

Again, it really doesn’t get any more simple than this.

The Wolfpack falls to a respectable 5-1 for the season, at least one game better than most fans expected at this point of the season. State has another important out of conference clash on Saturday at 3pm on the road at Marquette. The Golden Eagles are a surprising 6-1 to start the season, losing by one point to Florida State in the finals of the Old Spice Classic on Sunday. (Link)

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09-10 Basketball

149 Responses to State can’t stay undefeated – can Farnold Degand get is *(#&$ together to help this team?

  1. JeremyH 12/02/2009 at 5:38 PM #

    it’s not Degand’s fault. it’s not Lowe’s fault. it’s not Tom O’Brien’s fault.

    It’s my fault. My bad, fellas.

  2. wolfonthehill 12/02/2009 at 5:45 PM #

    ^ You’re joking… but when your freshman year was the fall of 1989, you do sorta feel responsible…

  3. choppack1 12/02/2009 at 6:07 PM #

    “But Lowe didn’t invent being at the bottom of the ACC – that part isn’t his fault, you can’t blame him for the past 20 years”

    can we blame him for the last 2? Can we blame him for last year?

    I generally fall into the category of “I’ll give him a chance and even next year, but I see ZERO evidence that he’ll turn it around.” And I don’t think last night’s game means we’ll stink.

    Still, there is no evidence of past success, there is no evidence that things will turn around if we’re talented. The only thing we know is that he’s got a great PG signed up for next year.

    Thinking Lowe will turn this around is not supported by any evidence – and so you can’t blame people for being hesitant to jump on the bandwagon.

  4. Pack Mentality 12/02/2009 at 6:23 PM #

    I just hope that the games are more enjoyable to watch than this game, even if we lose. I won’t say anything else negative right now, I mean it’s our only loss. Even though my hopes aren’t high, I won’t bellyache until the losses actually come. I guess I’m actually happy to be at 5-1 right now.

  5. Wulfpack 12/02/2009 at 6:36 PM #

    Sometimes I feel like Lee Fowler himself is crafting some of these posts. Zero accountability. Zero expectations. Blame it all on the past. Call us morons for wanting some sort of objective evidence that things are moving in the right direction. It’s infuriating.

  6. theghost 12/02/2009 at 6:38 PM #

    ^^^ yep, I think you can blame him for last year, or for any year where he didn’t get the talent he should have gotten or performed with that talent as well as he should’ve. I think he came up a little short on that, it seems that others feel he came up way short, and I guess that’s the root of the debate here. That, and the fact that just because you can blame him doesn’t mean you should fire him. I don’t want him to be perfect, I do want him to be improving.

    I disagree that there’s no evidence of past success – I maintain that when he had Atsur, he not only performed, but outperformed – he was 2-1 in Triangle play, and I’m confident he didn’t have comparable talent.

    But I do appreciate the hesitancy to jump on the bandwagon.

  7. fullmoon1 12/02/2009 at 6:50 PM #

    After letting last nights loss sink in and marinating a little I have concluded that: we have suffered more painful and ugly losses, the eratic sustitiutions seems to have disappeared with last years team, and we were in the game in the last two minutes. Therefore we will win some of these games. I think the youngins got some valuable experience in this game. I love the differences in opinion and the debates going on. Its a beautiful thing and It was Jeremy H’s fault. (way to be accountable Jeremy, lol)

  8. JeremyH 12/02/2009 at 10:18 PM #

    “I disagree that there’s no evidence of past success – I maintain that when he had Atsur, he not only performed, but outperformed – he was 2-1 in Triangle play, and I’m confident he didn’t have comparable talent.”

    Right but that’s only because they still remembered the fundamentals that Herb taught them. By year two they had forgotten. : )

  9. whitefang 12/03/2009 at 10:00 AM #

    For you Bradley since this must be a football thread now:
    My lord. We are in the ACC. Hell we practically started ACC FOOTBALL (I guess we did since we actually had a team when it started?). We have a FOOTBALL heritage (well our all-time winning percentage is 0.504 so that’s a stretch). We were a FOOTBALL school for many years (sorry but we’ve never been known as a football school). We’ve won 2 national championships (actually ZERO in football) and many ACC championships (well I think 7 including co-championships. is that many?). Our coach is in YEAR 3 and we get our butt pretty much handed to us by SOUTH freakin CAROLINA on our own home field. We got a full schedule of UNC, Duke, Wake, Clemson, etc ahead of us. And people still defend TOM O’BRIEN. It’s not his fault, the kid got hurt, the kid couldn’t pass math, its not his fault our DEFENSE looks like a trainwreck, blah, blah blah.
    Don’t mean to insult anybody, but damn short of a miracle that ain’t likely to happen, we are going to suck out loud this year (true) and for the foreseeable future unless we make a coaching change after this year (maybe but between Lowe and O’Brien I’ll still take the latter).
    Got that off my chest and I feel a little better.
    You’re welcome

  10. choppack1 12/03/2009 at 10:30 AM #

    “I disagree that there’s no evidence of past success – I maintain that when he had Atsur, he not only performed, but outperformed – he was 2-1 in Triangle play, and I’m confident he didn’t have comparable talent.”

    The man is in his 4th year and you are basing your evidence off of 3 games? Yes, we did perform OK when Atsur was in the lineup – but here’s something to ask about – has the talent gap between us and those other 2 programs increased or decreased?

    Hey, the good news is that it is only 1 game – and it’s unfair to make any judgement on how a season will end up based on that one game. However, looking at the Northwestern game as a test as to how we’ll perform against major competition – well, it doesn’t give me the warm and fuzzies.

    That’s OK though – the season goes on – and we’ve got Marquette Saturday.

  11. fernandopacker 12/03/2009 at 10:46 AM #

    After watching UNC and Duke this year I would say the talent level has decreased.

  12. Thinkpack17 12/03/2009 at 11:18 AM #

    ^Indeed…Despite Clemson coming apart at the seams last night they still have enough talent and athletes to scare the hell out of me. Maryland has a great PG so they will be a terrible matchup for us, but watching bits and pieces of Wake, Miami, VT, VA, and BC play over the last couple of days I would agree the rest of the slots in the ACC are wide open. I think BC and FS are two well coached squads though.

  13. bradleyb123 12/03/2009 at 11:19 AM #

    whitefang, I didn’t know you had it in you. Any sarcasm aside, it’s nice to see TOB and Sid finally judged equally.

  14. whitefang 12/03/2009 at 11:50 AM #

    I’m not sure it is possible to judge them equally is my point. Its apples and oranges. Still I was terribly disappointed in our fb season and I do believe that is TOB’s responsibility. I expected better.
    To me though it would be hard for me to be disappointed in our basketball season. Disappointment implies expectation, and my expectations for us this bb season were never high and based on the game under discussion (which I watched for a change until I became disgusted), the results were unfortunately not surprising.
    But at the end of the day we’re on the same side, just interpreting the scenery a little differently…

  15. choppack1 12/03/2009 at 11:56 AM #

    Bradleyb – If you’ve enjoyed success in a very similar position, you can at least tell people. “I know what I’m doing, look at my record. You’ll see that I produced solid results…and hey, I even struggled some at the beginning.”

    If you improve on the record of your predecessor for 2 consecutive years, you can say that a step back was a fluke.

    However, if you have a:
    1) No significant positive results at a similar position that prove you know what you are doing.
    2) Have not improved upon your predecessor’s resuls.

    You really have no evidence whatsoever you’ve got what it takes to be successful in your current position. This shouldn’t interpretted as saying that “Sidney Lowe will fail.” Only that he hasn’t proven he’s likely to succeed.

    I have seen some encouraging signs and I’m definitely excited about his recruiting. However, when I see a performance like I saw Tuesday night, it’s hard for me to be conifident about our future. Now, if we end up stringing together some good games and I see 40 minutes of intensity and focus against good comp, that will make more confident.

  16. NeverGiveUp 12/03/2009 at 8:42 PM #

    As I watched our game and flipped around watching other games, it seemed to me that our freshman looked like they had just started playing basketball while freshmen on other teams looked like they been playing basketball most of their life.

    Could our guys be over coached (afraid to make a mistake) or just over rated?

  17. ms termeaner 12/04/2009 at 10:23 AM #

    ^ Over coached? Are you serious?

  18. Class of 2009 12/04/2009 at 10:35 AM #

    “Could our guys be over coached (afraid to make a mistake) or just over rated?”

    I see what you are getting at with the “over-coached” comment (big brother is watching so don’t @#$% up!). I think what is more likely is you have an underdog team by virtue of their talent level and they start realizing they can play hard and win, so they start freaking and throwing up sacks of crap from beyond the arc. I think it’s more likely that you just have a bunch of players who are “good”, but not ACC-quality or under-developed at this point who are forced to play with sub-par upperclassmen (something more teams don’t have to deal with) and a “new” program.

    As far as saying the players are “just over-rated”, keep in mind that no one claimed these players we currently have are absolute knock-outs. I don’t think they are failing to meet any expectations at the moment, but if the 2010 and 2011 classes come in and perform similarly, there will be Hell to pay…

  19. ms termeaner 12/04/2009 at 10:38 AM #

    ^Lets not forget 2020 and 2021. Not to worry 2009 your boy is not going anywhere !

  20. Class of 2009 12/04/2009 at 10:49 AM #

    ^So if you are going to make that remark, you are telling me you don’t feel there is any obvious difference between the recruiting classes of 2006-2009 and 2010-2011. I’m hoping you just haven’t been paying attention. Check out the forums and there is a thread that lays all that out pretty black-and-white (if I can make a forum-plug in the blog).

    Even the article, being pretty down about NC State admits “…our (expected) weak guard play…”. No one claimed these guys were great and no one claims Sid’s first few years of recruiting were all that great. If anything, that is the one thing that everyone agreed on. If you want to complain about “Let’s not forget 2020 and 2021”, then at least have the sense to acknowledge that there is a visible difference between the Sid-the-recruiter before now and now. It’s a night-and-day comparison.

  21. HPWolf 12/04/2009 at 12:07 PM #

    Can someone tell me how we shot 2 of 18 from the 3 point line when we were on our home court and most of the shots were open looks with no defender in our face. I watched the game and it was a team wide effort but damn, we were on our home court. Do we not ever practice on this court? This does not bode well for this year. Wood will no doubt make us proud some nights but this will be a long season for the true fans of NCSU. And where is the up tempo Sid spoke of? We have not broke 70 points yet and we have played the soft part of our schedule.I give credit to Smith. He is a warrior out there but man o man he needs some help. I know sid has some good recruits coming in but we are looking at a minimum of 5 years from when he walked in to actually see some results. He will get to the end of next year to show what he can do.

    On a positive note I seen my first State game(New Orleans) at the RBC from one of the suites and I can tell you that with good friends, a carolina fan to remind of their recent football loss, free unlimited beer and food, the basketball score is a lot less important. Pass me another free beer.

  22. Gene 12/04/2009 at 12:14 PM #

    “Yes, we did perform OK when Atsur was in the lineup – but here’s something to ask about – has the talent gap between us and those other 2 programs increased or decreased?”

    I think part of the problem we have regarding talent is the lack of upperclassmen in our program right now. The 2006 class, i.e. seniors is Dennis Horner and Farnold Degand, whose progress has been limited by injuries. The 2007 class was Hickson, Johnson, Thomas, Javi and Smith. Hickson and Johnson are not longer here and Thomas has had his career effected by knee injuries.

    We’re asking freshman and sophomores to step up and make significant contributions this year, when they may not be ready for it. The two high impact freshmen we did recruit for 2009 were Brown and Howell. Brown failed to qualify and Howell is recovering from knee surgery.

    As far as closing the talent gap goes, no one in college basketball will close the talent gap against UNC. As long as Roy can keep a recruiting class relatively intact, i.e. free from too many early departures to the NBA, he’s going to win a national title every 3 years, because no one else in college basketball comes close to matching the talent he can put out on the floor.

    UNC men’s basketball is more dominant now, under Roy Williams, than they have ever been at any point in their history that I can remember.

    We may eventually close the talent gap with Duke, assuming no one gets injured, and can play for a few years.

    The only sign of “hope” I have right now is the three upperclassmen, who are regularly playing seem to have gotten a lot better under this coaching staff. Maybe it will translate into something positive in the future.

  23. Gene 12/04/2009 at 12:16 PM #

    “Do we not ever practice on this court?”

    I’m not 100% sure, but I do not think we practice at the RBC center. I think we have a separate practice facility for basketball.

  24. HPWolf 12/04/2009 at 12:46 PM #

    “As far as closing the talent gap goes, no one in college basketball will close the talent gap against UNC. As long as Roy can keep a recruiting class relatively intact, i.e. free from too many early departures to the NBA, he’s going to win a national title every 3 years, because no one else in college basketball comes close to matching the talent he can put out on the floor.”

    Gene, You’re right. Roy is a nice guy but he makes me sick with his recruiting. He brings in freshman that look like next years lottery pick. He can’t retire soon enough.

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