Shocking – Lee Fowler Still Doesn’t Get It

Lodged deep within the N&O’s write-up of the upcoming Wolfpack hoops season (all WTNY, all the time, just like the buffoonish duo of Fowler and Lowe want it) is this little gem from Fowler’s always jabbering mouth:

Too many times, loyalty’s a one-way street. Fans want the coach to be loyal to them, but they’re not loyal to the coach.

Pardon my language, but this is the biggest crock of shit Lee Fowler has ever served up (and that’s really saying something). It’s a perfect microcosm of his asinine philosophy – by being “loyal” and almost never firing anybody, no matter how weak the results, he believes he will get “loyalty” in return. That is, should one of his coaches turns out to have a clue, they’ll stick around and not seek other jobs or ask for a raise. Seriously – that’s how this man “thinks.”

Assuming you have an IQ above room temperature, you understand that 21st century college athletics is a big business, not a “Mom and Pop” operation. Hell, that’s been true for almost fifty years. And no, Lee, the vast majority of fans (again, with the room temperature vs. IQ caveat) don’t want loyalty. They want results. And frankly, I expect the ones that get those results to be paid commensurately with what they deliver. That’s why I have been a paying member of the Wolfpack Club since the day I graduated – so that we have the resources to attract and keep winners.

Of course, you can imagine what kind of coaches are attracted to the “no pressure, we just want loyalty!” ground rules. That’s right, coaches who can’t hack it on the open market. Where winning brings financial reward, and losing brings a pink slip. The most determined, driven, and ultimately successful coaches aren’t worried about failure. They don’t need Clueless Lee’s security blanket. And that’s why Wolfpack athletics will be stuck in a seemingly endless cycle of mediocrity.

We learned last spring that at least one major donor values having a golf buddy over leadership that strives for championships. And apparently the other heavy hitters who feel otherwise don’t feel it strongly enough to draw a line in the sand. You and I can’t change that sad state of affairs, but you can stop enabling this twisted regime.

About BJD95

1995 NC State graduate, sufferer of Les and MOC during my entire student tenure. An equal-opportunity objective critic and analyst of Wolfpack sports.

09-10 Basketball AD & Department Coaches NC State Administration Sidney Lowe

123 Responses to Shocking – Lee Fowler Still Doesn’t Get It

  1. ruffles31 11/12/2009 at 2:50 PM #

    TOB4PREZ, thanks for the clarification. And with Brown being counted twice, for curiosity sakes I wonder where we would have ended up last year.

    And upon looking them up on Scout.com a minute ago, I see that we are second this year in the ACC behind UNC-Nike and one spot in front of Duke, although all this could change with Harrison Barnes selection of a school tomorrow. It would be nice to add CJ Leslie to the mix.

  2. TOB4PREZ 11/12/2009 at 2:53 PM #

    I’m still trying to figure out why Sid was coaching the soccer team when they beat UNC yesterday….

    ———————————————————————
    Are you also still trying to figure out who the men’s soccer coach ANSWERS to???

    hint- the same person that hired Sid and TOB.

  3. WolfOG 11/12/2009 at 3:17 PM #

    This really is about loyalty, blind loyalty in many cases. Universities, more so than any other organization I can think of, survive on loyalty. The loyalty and emotions of its alumni and boosters translated into cash is what makes the machine run, especially for athletics.

    We give money, time, our voices, and occasionally our sanity to support our chosen school. No one of sound mind expects this to be a business transaction with a tangible return on investment. We give because we are emotionally invested in NC State. For this, most of us have what I consider to be reasonable expectations.

    If Fowler were merely incompetent, we as a fanbase would still have every right to express our opinions on that subject or withhold or re-direct our support as we see fit. He is ultimately responsible for our athletic success or lack thereof – he signed on for it, and if he doesn’t like hearing what we think, he is free to move the hell on.

    However, Fowler is not content to just sit there and suck. He has regularly chosen to take an adversarial stance with his fanbase. He has taken what is generally understood to be a job requirement for an AD (gracefully handling fan discontentment) and brought the fight to the fans. He attempts to marginalize, denigrate, and disrespect any of us who would dare point out the obvious decline of athletics at NC State. I find it ironic and sad that the ONE successful PR move by this horribly unsavvy regime is to successfully paint it’s entire fanbase as discontented, unreasonable and extreme. Make no mistake, the media has picked up that drum and beats it whenever possible.

    IF we had a University leadership that was remotely interested in athletic success or accountability, the “Fowler situation” would have been taken care of long ago. What I believe we do have is a culture of self hatred and fear when it comes to athletics that endeavours to expend the least amount of effort required to maintain a reasonably solvent athletic department.

    And I agree with Wolfpacktexx – Bobby Purcell has become the enabler for this regime – in the face of tremendously underwhelming athletic results across the board, he has managed to increase donors, raise huge sums of money, take on giant capital projects for the athletic department. A yeoman’s effort that unfortunately only feeds the beast and covers up a sewer of mismanagement and skewed priorities. Bobby Purcell is the Phillip Rivers of this athletic department.

    As far as I’m concerned, part of an AD’s responsibility is run his department in such a way as to engage and motivate a loyal fanbase (mostly this involves winning games and not insulting that fanbase at every opportunity).

    Lee Fowler asks for, expects and takes your loyalty with one hand in the form of donations, season tickets, lifetime rights money and asses in the seats.

    If what you are going to give me back with the other hand is not just subpar results but outright open derision, then no amount of scorn, criticism or calls for your job is too much. Lee has earned it all.

    And anyway – HE STARTED IT!

  4. BJD95 11/12/2009 at 3:31 PM #

    Recruiting is only a means to an end, not an end itself. And frankly, I don’t care if you win by coaching up lesser talent, or recruiting extremely well – as long as you win.

    You see, I’m a BASKETBALL fan. And a FOOTBALL fan. NOT a recruiting fan.

    Sidney Lowe has not produced a single basketball team that is even better than putrid defensively. That’s not a blue-chip talent problem. That leads me to question whether he would win much even with overwhelming talent (and the most he’s ever going to get is Top 20ish talent, which won’t overwhelm better coached opponents). There are also larger questions related to program stewardship and work ethic.

    And how laughably sad it is that someone would come on here and claim Fowler is vindicated by the soccer team winning a CONFERENCE QUARTERFINAL match, after having by far the best season in at least a decade (under the same coach) – which resulted in finishing 7th out of 9 in ACC play.

    Sure, if you keep a coach forever with no performance results, they will eventually pull a halfway decent season or two out of their rear ends. If you find that vindicating, then you and I aren’t even speaking the same language.

  5. Pack Mentality 11/12/2009 at 3:34 PM #

    I agree completely with WolfOG.

  6. choppack1 11/12/2009 at 3:45 PM #

    excellent post WolfOG.

    BJD – don’t focus on the ACC, focus on the national ranking.

  7. TOB4PREZ 11/12/2009 at 4:27 PM #

    oh, and you also have YET to answer my question about WHO has recruited better as NCSU’s Men’s Basketball Coach in their first 4 years at the helm.

    but ehh… don’t worry about it, your NOT answering is answering plenty LOUD enough for me.

    Thanks.
    TOB4PREZ: you have made your point. Don’t ruin a good thread by carrying on any further. Thanks.

    that’s fine, but what happened to my post that preceded this one???

  8. sautz 11/12/2009 at 4:53 PM #

    I’ll bite – Valvano in his first 4 years? His recruiting classes were partially responsible for a national championship.
    I think we can throw out anyone before him for consideration since “recruiting” wasn’t the nationally recognized money making sport it is today, unless you know how say, Gus Tebell’s first classes were ranked?
    He certainly out recruited Les Robinson, who was under recruiting restrictions. On paper he has out recruited Herb, but the only 2 good ACC players I have seen Sidney have for sure are JJ Hickson and Tracy Smith so I think the jury may still be out.
    How about this question… How many NC State coaches have had worse ACC finishes than Sidney Lowe in his first 3 years?
    Last time I checked wins and losses were more important than projections of how high schoolers will play in college.

  9. WV Wolf 11/12/2009 at 4:54 PM #

    TOB4PREZ, looking up recruiting classes for coaches 20 years ago is not the easiest thing to do. Lucky for you, I like to do that sort of thing.

    If you consider 80-81 to be Norm Sloan’s class (since I’m assuming you consider 06-07 to be Sendek’s players), then Jim Valvano in his first class in 81-82 had Cozell McQueen, Lorenzo Charles and Terry Gannon. His fourth class in 84-85 had Chris Washburn, Vinny Del Negro, Quentin Jackson and a JUCO guard named Nate McMillan.

    That LOUD enough for ya?

  10. TOB4PREZ 11/12/2009 at 5:07 PM #

    Valvano’s 4th class turned out pretty good, but I don’t think I’d be pimpin’ the one that had Cozell in it. Also, that’s just 1 (or 2) out of 4. And again, JV had the advantage of State coming off of some pretty stout finishes within the ACC, which I don’t think Sid did. I mean sure Herb took them to 5 consecutive NCAA’s but his ACC finishes in those years only included 1 time in the top 3 of the league. And of course we know that Sid hasn’t had a top 3 finish yet, but he’s still been able to keep selling our program to some of the most talented high school ballers in the country…. that has to account for something. I’m of the opinion that Sid be given the chance to prove himself through 2010-11, and if after that he hasn’t taken them to the dance and made some noise in the ACC regular season standings, then we show him the door. Considering how difficult our last coaching search proved to be (and it wasn’t from a lack of effort/offering), I can only imagine how much harder it would be to find someone willing to come here and put “their team together” when they realize that the man before them was shown the door before he was allowed to do that very thing.
    That’s all I’ve got on this for now…. I’m still remaining optimistic that Sid can coach and that he’s now got a team that’s willing to BUY-IN to what he’s selling, as opposed to the ones prior, which (according to the very players in the lockerroom) did not.

  11. VaWolf82 11/12/2009 at 5:37 PM #

    is recruiting NOT a “performance standard”???

    What are you judging recruiting on….Scout/Rivals rankings or wins??? There is only one way to evaluate coaches….wins. That one metric gathers in all of various aspects of “coaching”, including recruiting.

  12. waxhaw 11/12/2009 at 5:41 PM #

    I consider myself very loyal. In general, I would never stop donating to the university/wolfpack club because of something that I didn’t like. I would voice my opinion and hope for a change. I would speak out against those who withheld donations and try to convince them that overall this practice hurts the university. My thoughts are starting to change somewhat.

    It is not the year’s of losing that bother me, although that certainly doesn’t help. It’s the way the university deals with things. Here are a few examples:

    1) The unexplicable firing of Lennie Barton from the alumni association, even though he had support from the alumni board.

    2) Lee Fowler’s insistance on saying stupid things. Whether he means them or not, I cringe when I hear him speak. He is not a great ambassador for our university and he definitley over values his abilities.

    3) The way our entire university deals with media relations, which includes constantly changing our logos, lack of properly publicising our accomplishments and the quality of our publications (wolfpacker, coaches shows, announcers, etc.)

    4) The way the wolfpack club handles away game ticket assignment and parking pass assignment. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve heard stories of people in Raleigh popping in and finding better LTR seats than what was known to be available. I’ve seen several instances of people with much worse rank than mine get parking passes that thought I was trying to request.

    5) The seemingly good ole boy network.

    I don’t give massive amounts of money to the university/wolfpack club but it’s not peanuts. Out of curiosity, I added up every check I wrote to the wolfpack club/university this year. It was a little over $9,000. I would imagine there are a lot of universities that would love to get $9,000 every year.

    For the first time in my life, I find myself not caring. When I stop caring, I’m sure I’ll find other places to send my money. Especially when my tax rate goes up next year and I have less to spend.

    NC State needs an enima starting at the top. They have all of the pieces in place to be the best university in the state and one of the best in the nation. The problem seems to be that we reward tenure and relationships over results on and off the field. That is not a formula for success in my book and I’m sick of helping to sustain it.

    I doubt I’ll advertise in the wolfpacker next year. I’m definitely not advertising on the coaches radio show. I may not renew some of my LTR’s and the saddest thing of all is I have lost my passion for the Wolfpack. I’m getting to the point where I just don’t care anymore. I am numb. I’m sure some of these feelings will subside before time to make those decisions but they’ve been growing stronger each of the last few years and eventually they will win out.

    PS…just in case you do not know me and think I’m part of some lunatic fring. I supported Sendek through about 7-8 years. I supported Amato up until his firing. I still believe TOB and Lowe can win at NC State. This is more about our administration and the way we approach things.

  13. BJD95 11/12/2009 at 5:41 PM #

    The answer to your question is “I don’t give a shit.” You see, they don’t hang banners for recruiting – even if you want to hang one for overall Top 20ish recruiting (and probably only get there by counting Lorenzo Brown twice.

    But in truth, Sendek’s recruiting was probably in the vicinity of Lowe’s first four years. Same with V. Les was clueless and on probation.

    Lowe’s recruiting has also fallen into three categories – extremely marginal academic cases, random projects Towe finds, and guys that one of Lowe’s NBA buddies gets for us from the metro ATL area.

    Your mileage may vary as to how sustainable that is likely to be.

  14. WV Wolf 11/12/2009 at 5:56 PM #

    waxhaw, I have similar feelings about the university in general and about becoming more and more apathetic. You’d much rather have an angry fanbase than an apathetic fanbase, if they’re angry that means they still care.

    Right now it is 2 hours until tipoff for the opening basketball game of the season and I am debating if going out in the cold rain is worth the trouble. Five years ago the idea of not going would have never entered my mind.

  15. choppack1 11/12/2009 at 6:01 PM #

    I stopped giving a while back. I may yet give again but essentially right now, donations to the WPC are the equivalent of giving a homeless man reeking of alcohol 20 bucks.

  16. packalum44 11/12/2009 at 6:24 PM #

    BJD you are a trip.

  17. BJD95 11/12/2009 at 6:46 PM #

    I will be right in chop’s shoes starting in 2010. And frankly, it’s going to take a hell of a lot to get me to buy in after sacrificing all my rank, LTRs, etc.

  18. BJD95 11/12/2009 at 6:50 PM #

    Thanks, 44, I’ll be here all week. Don’t forget to tip your waitstaff.

  19. BJD95 11/12/2009 at 6:53 PM #

    And chop, I’ve thought about trying to get NC State on A and E’s “Intervention.”

  20. tjfoose2 11/12/2009 at 7:05 PM #
  21. GAWolf 11/12/2009 at 7:26 PM #

    I have a beer in my hand and I’m going to hold it up for a second in honor of TOB4PREZ. That kid is RELENTLESS. In honor of your fortitude, young man….

    I’ve saved a paltry amount of money to rejoin the WPC the DAY Lee Fowler is fired. It’s the thought that counts…

  22. LRM 11/12/2009 at 7:27 PM #

    Even if they did hang banners for recruiting, they’d hang them in Hargrave’s gym, not ours.

  23. GAWolf 11/12/2009 at 7:28 PM #

    WVWolf: I used the same theory to assess my standing with many ex-girlfriends and even at times my wife. As long as someone cares enough to be mad… there’s still some screwing up to be had.

  24. Dogbreath 11/12/2009 at 7:29 PM #

    We’ve had 5 football coaches since our last ACC championship 31 years ago.

    We’ve had 3 basketball coaches since our last ACC championship 22 years ago.

    We’ve had 1 baseball coach since our last ACC championship 18 years ago.

    That’s 71 combined sports seasons spanning 9 coaches, and average of eight seasons for each to deliver not one single league championship.

    Fans have been patient.

    Fuck you Lee Fowler!

  25. Alpha Wolf 11/12/2009 at 7:33 PM #

    ^ The Chicago Cubs of the ACC.

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