Cheap Seats Football Retrospective: Part V, 2009

1999 NC State Football Helmet

The view from LRM's seats in Section 30

This is the final part of a five-part series that is by no means intended to be authoritative. Rather, it’s nothing more than an incomplete, inconclusive, sometimes erroneous, while always biased retrospective of recent State football history. Part of this was based on nothing more than my attempt to answer the question so many of us are left asking year after year: How did we get here?

Part I: The 90s
Part II: Chuck
Part III: 17
Part IV: TOB

Part V: 2009 (and Beyond)
1999 NC State Football Helmet2008 was State’s third consecutive losing season while after two seasons, Tom O’Brien is 11-14. Regardless, many of us have seen enough evidence to make us confident that a breakout is imminent. Meanwhile, some of you believe that this will be that breakout season. The rationale is that after a dismal first half last season, State demonstrated marked improvement down the stretch, and the level of play in November is more indicative of what we should expect than that in September.

After all, for the first time in a half-decade, there is absolutely no issue at quarterback – Russell Wilson proved he’s a leader and that he’ll deliver in the clutch. He threw 17 touchdowns with only a single interception in 11 games, and he was both the conference’s highest rated passer (133.9) and led it in total offense (213 yards per game). He was also both highly effective and efficient in the red zone, as State was second in the ACC with 27 touchdowns and only two turnovers (one fumble, one turnover on downs).

O’Brien’s second team played with greater discipline – we averaged 42.3 penalty yards per game in 2008 (T-4th ACC), an improvement of 12.2 yards per game over 2007 (54.5, 7th ACC) and 15.7 yards per game from 2006 (58.0, 11th ACC). Turnover margin also improved – we were plus-eight in 2008 (3rd ACC), an improvement of 24 over 2007 (minus-16, 12th ACC) and 19 over 2006 (minus-11, 12th ACC). The much-improved team – with a quarterback, better discipline and a favorable turnover margin – returns seven starters on offense and six (minus Nate Irving) on defense, and for the first time under O’Brien, there is at least some depth at the skill positions and on both lines, which leaves us a little more wriggle room to accommodate minor injuries throughout the season.

All the above makes for a very good team and a realistic shot at playing in Tampa on December 5. Right?

Not so fast, my friend. Personally, I just don’t think this is our breakout year. But then again, a lifetime of experience requires me to be cautiously optimistic, so my expectations are tempered for 2009.

Besides being a losing team last season (6-7), that defense was pretty dreadful. We were last in the conference in scoring defense (26.3 points per game), total defense (390.9 yards per game), and passing defense (248.7); 11th in pass defense efficiency (129.7); eighth in rushing defense (142.2); and 10th in sacks (23). We were last in opponent first downs (278), opponent fourth down conversions (12), and allowed the most red zone scoring opportunities (50). That was a pretty wretched defense before Irving’s injury left a big ol’ gaping hole on the weak side, likely for the season.

Counting the Florida State loss last season, when he played only a few series, Irving missed a total of four games, but still managed to make his overwhelming presence known with 80 tackles, 11 tackles for loss, four interceptions and nine passes defended. Now granted, while his injury isn’t as devastating to us as it would have been the past two seasons, it’s still a tall order to expect middle linebackers Ray Michel (who is now the only returning starter at linebacker from 2008) and the untested – albeit very talented – group of Sterling Lucas, Terrell Manning and Dwayne Maddux to immediately step in and fill Irving’s hole. But then again, Nate was untested as a redshirt freshman in 2007, when he played in all 11 games and eventually earned the starting role for the final four games of the season. So while it’s not impossible, it would be unexpected.

Looking at the schedule, my realistic prediction is a record of 7-5 and a trip to Orlando to the Champs Sports Bowl.

We have a manageable conference schedule, with Duke, Maryland, Clemson, and Carolina each at home; we end the season with three of our final four games at Carter-Finley, and November has been the stretch when O’Brien’s first two teams have each come together. The road is obviously less favorable, but not entirely unbearable. We don’t have to go to either Atlanta or Charlottesville, which have both been big black holes for State football over the past two decades. Instead, in October we have that dreaded trip to Winston – one win (2001) in our last six visits – and then up to Chestnut Hill, where we’ve lost in our past two visits (2005 & 2007); but we (somehow) won our last trip to Blacksburg (2004) and we’ve actually managed Tallahassee fairly well this decade – wins in 2001 and 2005, and we came up just short in the two-overtime thriller in 2003.

The fact remains, we have to win the games we’re supposed to win, especially at home. If we want to make New Year’s plans (or even late December plans), then we must take care of business against Murray State, Gardner-Webb (who gave Georgia Tech all they could handle last season), and the suddenly-chic Duke. South Carolina is a game we should win at home, but right now, I see losses at Wake, Florida State, and Virginia Tech, and probably at home to the Big East favorite, Pittsburgh. And for all of you that think that Thanksgiving Saturday matchup is a sure-bet, just know that it scares me to death – not only will they be a very good team, but does anyone remember the last time we beat Carolina three straight? Exactly.

What worries me most is that Russell Wilson won’t sneak up on anyone this year, which is how we’ll find out just how good he really is – the great ones like Philip are prolific despite whatever game plan an opposing coach can concoct to counter him. I also expect at least some regression in his seemingly-outrageous numbers. But, while it’s unrealistic to expect Wilson to put up the same touchdown-to-interception ratio as last season, it’s not unreasonable to expect him to continue making good decisions or keep escaping danger in the pocket. This is why he can inflict such chaos upon an opposing defense in so many different ways — it’s proven nearly impossible to trap him in a collapsing pocket and even more difficult to force him into a bad decision. I fully expect him to give opposing defenses absolute fits, and hopefully Owen Spencer will haul in a few more that hit his hands in the open field this season.

And if Wilson somehow improves over last year, then ACC beware.

See how I hedge? I really want to be the optimist, but c’mon, I’ve been a State fan my entire life. Hope and optimism are not synonomous — undying hope and loyalty are inherent traits of the State fan, but certainly not optimism.

I’m not planning to throw oranges onto the field in Tampa after we beat Carolina for the second straight week, but I do have certain expectations for success. Foremost, this season I expect to keep demonstrating the measured improvement we’ve shown over the past two years with our discipline – fewer penalties at inopportune times – and increased turnover margin – creating scoring opportunities while limiting those we give away. I also want to see solid progression on the offensive line, for which O’Brien is renowned; in 2008 we were seventh in the ACC in time of possession (29:38), so this year we need to more effectively establish the run to limit our opponents’ scoring chances. Simple, huh?

Oh, and beat Carolina.

Look, I don’t expect to be in Miami on January 5. But Nashville – or even Atlanta with a win in Tallahassee or Blacksburg – isn’t a reach, is it?

I sure hope not, because next year I’m likely to become completely unreasonable.

LRM Note: Since I didn’t own a digital camera until after the 2004 season, the stadium pics at the top of Parts II & III were courtesy of my Canadian buddy who sits with me in Section 30 (I took the ones in Parts IV & V); he threatened to contact his lawyer if I didn’t acknowledge that. So thanks, eh.

About LRM

Charter member of the Lunatic Fringe and a fan, loyal to a fault.

'09 Football Flashback NCS Football Tom O'Brien

56 Responses to Cheap Seats Football Retrospective: Part V, 2009

  1. wolfwarrior 08/07/2009 at 6:52 AM #

    I loved reading your work (all 5 parts). Excellent job! SFN is becoming a really good home for excellent writing and posting on the Wolfpack. Thank you for that!

    Once thing is for sure, there is more realistic excitement about us being “extremely competitive” this year than any year I can remember going back over forty years or so. I like it (this football passion and expectation that something good is going to happen for our team) and can sense that a lot of my fellow Wolfpackers share the same realistic excitement.
    Everyone knows that the winning habit starts with the excellent leadership of the head coach and his staff, they instill hard work, dedication, preparation and the winning attitude, it moves in the trenches, then goes to the D, the QB play, the ability to mix up the O and move the chains, the special teams and finally not beating yourself.
    I say it’s about time! We can win our 8th ACC Championship! It’s up to how much we really, really want it! Desire to be a Champion!

  2. OwenDorm83 08/07/2009 at 8:01 AM #

    I think LRM is pretty much on the money. We should be more solid this year, but we’re not quite there yet. Certainly, having #16 on our side helps & hopefully he can avoid injury. Losing 56 hurts big on D. Secondary is questionable, but who knows – maybe someone will step up. I recall 56 making the tackle on the opening season kickoff couple years ago and asking “wow, who’s that guy?”

    Perspective: I was sitting there in my LTRs with 2 college buddies that I met within week or so (today) of being 30 years ago in Owen Dorm and with a 3rd that I’ve known since the 3rd grade. We’re hanging tough most of the game, but in the 4th quarter, Florida State is starting to pull away from us, and the game is getting (again) out of reach. Losing sucks. But, I thought, if I could be where-ever I wanted to be right then, where would that be? Vegas? Been there, done that. San Diego? Seattle? New York? Chicago? Daytona? Bristol (highly recommended, by the way – be there again in 2 weeks)? All ditto. Overseas? – don’t really care about it.

    Where would I rather be than sitting in CF right at that moment – who cares what the score is – ? NO WHERE.

    See y’all in a couple weeks…

  3. choppack1 08/07/2009 at 9:06 AM #

    The Irving injury – and subsequent secondary losses have dampened my enthusiasm a bit. While it’s problematic – we may be able to overcome them.

    While we always see plenty on Irving – we rarely see much written about AMC. Having watched our football team the last 2 years, I don’t think it’s coincidence that when we know our opponent is passing – and AMC is healthy – we’re getting an effective pash rush. Irving’s prescence seemed to have a RW type impact on our defense last year…When he was healthy, we were an OK D. However, to make matters worse, both he and AMC missed some key games…one of those games was the BC game (I think)..you put AMC in the lineup in that game and I go as far to say as maybe we win that game.

    Basically, before the Irving injury, I was downright excited – now I’m only cautiously optimistic. Hopefully, he heals up in a hurry and can be a factor in November – and we need him only to make a title run – not a bowl game.

  4. BJD95 08/07/2009 at 9:56 AM #

    The window for competing for ACC titles is 2010-12. It’s then or never, IMHO. Atlanta is our ceiling, I think 6-6 limbo is our floor. Think we can get to 8-4, but 7-5 is more likely. Think we’ll win our bowl game, though.

    BTW, Lucas, Manning, and Maddux called to insist that they want NOTHING to do with filling Irving’s hole. 🙂

  5. primacyone 08/07/2009 at 10:02 AM #

    It seems everyone else in America thinks we are going to suck again this year. USA Today Coaches Poll is out:

    http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/football/usatpoll.htm

    1. Florida (53)
    2. Texas (4)
    3. Oklahoma (1)
    4. Southern California
    5. Alabama
    6. Ohio State
    7. Virginia Tech
    8. Penn State
    9. LSU
    10. Mississippi
    11. Oklahoma
    12. California
    13. Georgia
    14. Oregon
    15. Georgia Tech
    16. Boise State
    17. TCU
    18. Utah
    19. Florida State
    20. North Carolina
    21. Iowa
    22. Nebraska
    23. Notre Dame
    24. Brigham Young
    25. Oregon State

    LRM Note: The frustrating thing about the polls for college football is that the way they’re set up, very few teams outside the preseaon top 10 have any shot at playing for a national title, regardless of how good they prove to be, especially when the top few are undefeated or lose only one game and lose it early (Auburn 2004 is an example). The exception to this is, obviously, Notre Dame, which needs only a win over Michigan to catapult into the top five. Preseason polls have little purpose beyond selling magazines, and a top-five match up in September is all relative, because we have no idea how good or bad either team will be at season’s end. I think the first poll should come out no earlier than the mid-October rivalry weekend. In the end, the preseason polls probably won’t affect us because even undefeated we’ll have a slim chance at playing for a national title, so in that case, our conference record will determine our bowl fate.

  6. primacyone 08/07/2009 at 10:07 AM #

    What does the future hold if we have another losing season? Really, what if we have another losing season this year? When does TOB have to accept the responsiblity for putting a winning product on the field?

    I mean dang, I like TOB, but it’s time to show some results. 6-7 is not going to cut it. Hell, the horrible “coach” over at UNC made it to 7-5 last year and GT seems light years ahead of us at this point.

    LRM Note: Call me crazy, but I seem to have more patience for a guy that’s already proven successful at rebuilding and winning at the major college level…as opposed to others that haven’t.

  7. TOBtime 08/07/2009 at 10:32 AM #

    We’re going to lose to Pittsburgh? Really?
    Is that based on their returning QB or running back or the stellar defense they have shown over the last couple of years? Or is it just a recognition of the general all-around outstanding coach that Wannstedt has proven over time to be?
    ^primacyone, you keep RW healthy all of last year and I’d bet we win at least 8 games. I personally don’t think this is our “breakout” year either. I think that will be next year with Glennon at the helm and our OL studs coming into play.

  8. phillypacker 08/07/2009 at 10:54 AM #

    Could we get primacyone’s post deleted? He is obviously a troll.

  9. Clarksa 08/07/2009 at 10:54 AM #

    It will be very interesting to see the reactions on the internets if we start slow for the third year in a row (losses to USC and Pitt)…

  10. McPete 08/07/2009 at 10:56 AM #

    I certainly hope this is the breakout year, because we could take a step back next year with several key losses. Eugene, Julian Williams, McCuller, Barbee, Larson, W. Young, AMC, Burgess, Michel, Clem Johnson, Koyal George, possibly (though not likely) Wilson, and Baker. I know TOB and staff are building depth, but that’s alot of starters.

  11. bradleyb123 08/07/2009 at 10:57 AM #

    Great read, LRM! But I think your 7-5 projection is a bit of a worst case scenario. Unless we have a rash of injuries like last year, or the swine flu hits the Pack or something unexpected like that, I can’t see this team winning less than 7 games.

    Here are some things that either weren’t mentioned, or that I disagree with. And that’s ok, right? In your disclaimer at the top, you said “sometimes erroneous!” That goes for me, too. These are just my thoughts… 🙂

    1) I expect a good game against SC, and a win by the Pack. We should be pretty close to 100%, and have a good returning cast. They’ve lost a lot, and are picked below us in most polls. I think the revenge factor, and the game being in C-F, will propel us to victory in a good game.

    2) I don’t think we lose to Pitt, not in C-F anyway. Not with this team.

    3) We lost Nate Irving, but we lost him WELL BEFORE fall practices began. We can’t replace him, but we have plenty of time to figure out what we will do in his absence. If we had lost him on the first play of the SC game, it would have been more devastating to us. At least we have plenty of time to prepare a “sans Nate” defense.

    4) Wake is a good team, but they aren’t a GREAT team any more. And they lost a lot on defense. I expect a good game, but a very winnable one. I don’t think their defense will stop our offense much at all, and we win a high scoring affair.

    5) I think this is the year we beat BC. Just a feeling.

    6) I believe VT is overrated. We still probably lose that game, but it isn’t outside the realm of possibility that we go to Blacksburg and come home with a win. It’s late in the year. We MAY even have Nate back by then, although I’m not counting on that.

    7) Carolina. They may have it together by November, or they may be a 6-win team. You asked when was the last time we beat them three in a row? Well I ask, when is the last time we beat them TWICE in a row? We just did, and the way we beat them in both games HAS to send a little fear through their veins. In 2007, only a couple of pick-sixes against Daniel Evans allowed them to keep the score closer than the game really was. I think they know that (not to mention “41-10”), and they have a tall order coming into C-F trying to get BMFD’s (as Carolina’s coach) first win over TOB. And again, we MAY have Nate back by late November.

    Basically, I think if we keep the injury and Swine flu bugs manageable, we will win more than seven games.

    I think this will be somewhat of a breakout season in that I think we should win at least eight games. But I expect the sky to be the limit in 2010 — especially if we find some way to keep RW at the helm.

    LRM Note: It’s no fun if we all agree on everything. And if you’re gonna disagree, this is a perfectly acceptable way of doing it. I’m standing firm that we won’t win Winston, though.

  12. McPete 08/07/2009 at 10:59 AM #

    I doubt primacyone is a unc troll, since he got their ’08 record wrong. they went 8-4, not 7-5.

    LRM Note: 8-5, actually, counting their bowl loss to WV.

    Pitt was picked by the big east media to win the conference, so they must be decent.

  13. bradleyb123 08/07/2009 at 11:05 AM #

    I don’t think primacyone is a troll. I mean, what if the team has a collective brain aneurysm and we end up with a losing record? That would be completely unexpected. At that point, would we (should we?) begin to question TOB? I mean, if he assembled what should be a pretty solid team, and then coached them to a losing record, what would that mean?

    ^^^ “Pitt was picked by the big east media to win the conference, so they must be decent.”

    Decent, yes. But we are talking about the Big East, here. And we have them in C-F. I just don’t see them coming in here and winning this game, although anything is possible.

  14. shomewood 08/07/2009 at 11:07 AM #

    Great write-up!

    I completely agree that “Hope and optimism are not synonomous — undying hope and loyalty are inherent traits of the State fan, but certainly not optimism”.

    With this season, however, something feels different. I get chills everytime I read, listen to, or watch something about the Wolfpack and the upcoming season. I have a feeling like I did when I was a kid (13) in 1998, when I told my Dad in the parking lot with complete confidence “We will beat FSU!” I am not saying we are going to win the ACC Championship, but I feel that 9-3 is not out of the questions.

    We have a coach with the calm and passion of Joe Paterno or “for an ACC refernce” Coach K. We have a complicated defensive system that I think the players will finally get after 3 years, despite its woes last year. Last we have leaders for the first time since Philip Rivers (on both sids of the ball) in Russell Wilson and Nate Irving (although out, can still make an inspirational impact).

    As for September 3, I haven’t been this excited about a game in a longtime. Go Pack!

  15. Mike 08/07/2009 at 11:09 AM #

    I think LRM is right on, and I hope we are better. The ACC is not stacked with guaranteed power teams, but at the same time, there is not an easy game on the schedule. It’s a cliche, but on any given day, I think any team can beat any team.

    A late fumble here, a bad bounce there, and one team can easily be knocked down a few notches. Good coaching helps eliminate these scenarios, but they do happen. I think we have the ability to win every game, but the reality is all the games will be close. No one expected USF last year to completely dominate, but that was without Irving and having Jeff George at QB. Stuff happens, and the likelihood of going 12-0 or even 11-1 is not realistic.

    IF everyone stays healthy, I think we have a legit shot at Tampa, but this is football and people dont always stay healthy. Our D is huge concern, and while the talent is there, it may still take awhile to gel as a unit and we could find ourselves on the short end of a few shootouts, especially early.

    Having said that, I HATE LOSING and I hope we win them all. I am ready, let’s start the season!

  16. Mike 08/07/2009 at 11:12 AM #

    Also, please dont forget the league office and the zebras. Swofford will find a way to make sure Cherry calls us for giving someone the business. As much as I dont like Cherry, that call was great, but it was stolen from NFL official Jim Tunney. Still have to love the terminology though even if it was plagirized.

  17. Sam92 08/07/2009 at 11:26 AM #

    i’m still optimistic, although losing nate irving sure hurts. the first game will be very telling – if we can beat south carolina, i see us having that breakout year and winning 9 games. if we can’t beat the gamecocks, i’m with you on the 7-5 prediction. all eyes on our first game

  18. primacyone 08/07/2009 at 11:27 AM #

    If you think I’m a troll, you’re not much of a state fan. And yes, they went 8-5 overall.

    So you will be fully satisfied if we go 6-7 again this year? Nothing wrong with that at all in your eyes? That would be 3 loosing seasons in a row for this staff anf possbily more importantly – no improvement at all in 3 years. MOC and CA got fired for much better performance than that.

    And yes, we could easily loose to Pitt. They were 9-4 last year and return 14 starters with 3 of them All-American Candidates. Two of those 3 All-American candidates are on the defensive side of the ball. That would be equivilant to us playing with two Nate Irving’s.

  19. Mike 08/07/2009 at 11:33 AM #

    Primacy – you have been trolling this board for years 🙂 I think all the regulars here know you and dont worry about it.

  20. packforestry 08/07/2009 at 11:33 AM #

    I’ve been following NC State athletics since I started school there in 2001. I’ll admit I have been very disappointed since Philip Rivers left with the way our football team has played. However, even with the last two seasons not being as good as I would have liked, I think that TOB is an excellent coach and is going to get us to the top of the ACC and high into the national rankings if not to the top. The improvements in discipline and turnovers are huge when it comes to winning games.

    I feel good about this season. I think we have an offense that is going to score points no matter who we play. I think our defense will be good enough to win games, especially with the kind of numbers I expect the offense to put up. This may be optimistic but I’m looking at a 5-1 or even a 6-0 start (we can and should beat all of those teams) before we get to the tough part of our schedule. By then we may have enough confidence and momentum to really get things going and win some big games. I’m picking a 9-3 season, 6-2 in the ACC.

  21. McPete 08/07/2009 at 11:38 AM #

    not sure if anyone has seen this, but it’s video footage from the Top Gun football camp where Rob Crisp won the overall best performer award. Lot’s of 4 and 5 star talent at this camp. you can also see Crisp shutting down Gabe King. He is going to be a good one. and supposedly he transferred to another HS, Cedar Ridge, so he could graduate early and be here for the spring semester.

    http://rivals.yahoo.com/video/recruiting-football/AMP-Top-Gun-impressive-linemen-52351;_ylt=AhynWQ3WjpfANOaR5IIpm58h7qB4

  22. durhamwolf19 08/07/2009 at 11:38 AM #

    Primacy – UNC lost their bowl game last year. 8-4 in regular season finished 8-5.

  23. McPete 08/07/2009 at 11:39 AM #

    primacy, UNC went 8-4 and LOST their bowl game to West Virginia.

  24. phillypacker 08/07/2009 at 11:40 AM #

    If there was one shred of evidence to indicate that State was not heading toward becoming an excellent football team, I could see the value of your comments. Your comment about the past two year’s records appears to disregard the shambles TOB inherited from CTC. When someone makes a post that appears to be in a world of its own apart from all the thoughtful conversation that takes place on this blog and is pointless and divisive, I don’t think it necessarily deserves to be posted. We could lose to anybody. UNC has been ballyhooed this way almost every year for as long as I can remember, which goes back to the 1960s. So no, I do not tremble at them. By the way, they were 8-4 and lost to WVU in the Car Care Bowl. Big deal. I think we somehow managed to eek out a win over them.

  25. choppack1 08/07/2009 at 11:41 AM #

    “The window for competing for ACC titles is 2010-12. It’s then or never, IMHO. ”

    Won’t we have to replace 4 starters on the DL next year, both safeties and 2 RBs?

    I mean, my title hopes have dampened for this year, but it’s not like we won’t have challenges going into next year. I might still go as far to say that we are/were in better shape for this year (especially before Irvings injury) than we will be for next.

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