Friedlander: Wolfpack Still Searching For Its Identity

Brett Friedlander of the Wilmington Star-News has an interesting column this morning, in which he posits that so far this year NC State as yet to reveal itself as either a good — or a bad — hoops squad:

ACC Insider: Wolfpack Still Searching For Its Identity

Five games in, the Wolfpack remains just as much a mystery as it was the day coach Sidney Lowe rolled out the balls for the opening day of practice back in mid-October.

Oh, there have been some positive signs, particularly the resurgence of big men Brandon Costner and Ben McCauley – both of whom might as well have redshirted last year for all they contributed.

[…]

At this point, the Wolfpack has the potential to be anything from an NCAA Tournament team to out of the postseason for the second year in a row.

A lot of the up and down play can be attributed to injuries, but at the same time, this is a Wolfpack team that has never been consistent — the same players were as maddeningly inconsistent under the previous coaching regime as they have been under Lowe.  Perhaps that is what their identity is – a team that can beat nearly anybody but can also lose to nearly anyone they play as well.

As Friedlander says, the NCAA is a possibility – the talent is there, assuming Degand can man the point guard position for a majority of minutes and that his play returns to the level is was just before he hurt his knee last seasn.  Also, Brandon Costner and Ben McCauley will have to play 100% every night, and at times, that has been a problem for the talented duo.

At the same time, a losing season in the ACC and a quick exit on the first day of the conference tournament is also a possibility.  Were that to happen Sidney Lowe and his vaunted incoming class for 2009 would be under enormous pressure, and quite possibly Lowe could be coaching to avoid fan revolt – I would say his job, but anyone who knows anything about Lee Fowler and NC State sports knows that Fowler will sit pat no matter what happens.

Bottom line is that talent is indeed on the way for Lowe and his NC State team, but that’s next year and Sidney Lowe needs to maximize this year’s team and get the most out of it that it can possibly achieve.  Slipping into the NCAA would certainly define him as a good coach and a good team-builder.  Having a repeat of last year would leave him with major question marks and a fanbase thinking that he may not be the leader to return NC State to college basketball glory.

08-09 Basketball

61 Responses to Friedlander: Wolfpack Still Searching For Its Identity

  1. burnbarn 12/15/2008 at 9:35 AM #

    We are not going to see the type of team Lowe wants until 2011. Next year we will have some good freshmen, but they will be freshmen and we will still have the same backcourt. In 2010, we bring in Leslie and finally a PG that can get up and down the court, but they too will be freshmen and will play like freshmen. The following year (2011) we will have experience, depth and talent.
    This could be sped up with the addition of Wall for 2009, but unless that happens this timeline for success is not that unrealistic. I am willing to wait.

    I hate it is going to take this long, but that is the way it is. And if Lowe is no longer the coach, then a new coach will have to start the process over losing out on the commitments we have for 2010 most likely. It sucks to be us and will for a few more years.

  2. choppack1 12/15/2008 at 9:56 AM #

    “this is a Wolfpack team that has never been consistent — the same players were as maddeningly inconsistent under the previous coaching regime as they have been under Lowe.”

    Actually – I don’t think you can call these guys inconsistent under the previous regime. Costner played one game for the previous regime before he sat out the rest of the season w/ a stress fracture. None of the other 2 saw a lot of playing time, but that wasn’t surprising – as these guys were behind established, experienced starters, nor they were part of the regular rotation. So, all we’ve got is 2 years under the current regime to judge these guys. They played pretty good in their first year – but, they were inconsistent in effort and execution…but they were first time starters – so you expect that. What you don’t expect is for returning starters to regress like we saw last year.

    I haven’t written this game or this team off, but I’m a little concerned that it appears our current staff may not teach fundamentals well enough to produce respectable results when there’s a talent gap between us and our opponent. The good news is that our staff may be good enough recruiters to minimize this problem.

  3. bradleyb123 12/15/2008 at 10:01 AM #

    I hope the fans are patient enough to wait out the hard times. We’ve been waiting a long time, so what is another year or two. We have to give SidLow his fair shake to do something. When the fans start grumbling, it doesn’t help anything, and it may even hurt recruiting. If potential recruits start thinking Sid is on the hotseat, they may not be anxious to sign the dotted line.

    I think this team can be pretty good this year. How well we play against ECU will tell us a lot. ECU is playing pretty well again this year. ECU would love nothing more than to leave Raleigh Wednesday night with a win that validates last year’s debacle in Greenville. In that sense, this is a pressure-packed, must-win game for State. If we respond and win, it shows we can play well against a decent team when the pressure is on. (I think we did that against Davidson, but just couldn’t hang on and win…)

    GO PACK!!!

  4. BJD95 12/15/2008 at 10:07 AM #

    This is clearly not an NCAAT-caliber team. At best, we will 6-10 in ACC play and not lose any embarrassing games (I count ECU in that category). At worst, we could be even shittier than last year.

    So far, I’d say we are more likely to go 6-10 than have a complete meltdown, but the PG play has been even worse than last year so far, and thus worst-case scenario is still possible.

  5. howlie 12/15/2008 at 10:17 AM #

    I’m nostalgic.

    I was trying to remember what sports reporters with newspapers used to do. Analysis, introspection, and providing the public with something to look ahead for with a team…. wow.

  6. Alpha Wolf 12/15/2008 at 10:36 AM #

    ECU would love nothing more than to leave Raleigh Wednesday night with a win that validates last year’s debacle in Greenville. In that sense, this is a pressure-packed, must-win game for State. If we respond and win, it shows we can play well against a decent team when the pressure is on.

    True. But I maintain that NC State has no business losing this game and if they do on their home floor it will be extremely indicative of a poor year similar to last year.

    At the same time, with all due respect to the Pie Rats, it shows how far we have fallen when most State knowledgeable State fans are openly worrying about losing at home to ECU.

  7. choppack1 12/15/2008 at 10:42 AM #

    BJD – Isn’t worrisome that we may be seeing another player take another step back in his 2nd year under our current staff? In this case, I’m talking about Javi. Last year, we saw 3 guys take 3 huge steps back in terms of their development in McCauley, Costner and Horner. So far, this year, McCauley looks like the only one who has gotten his confidence back.

    bradleyb – there’s great, there’s pretty good/OK, there’d mediocre and there’s the “you are a joke” category. Last year, we fell into the “you are a joke” category.

    Clearly, Fowler should be fired for ushering us back into Les Robinson territory.

  8. Alpha Wolf 12/15/2008 at 10:55 AM #

    I personally think that Javi is not ACC material and getting him to that level would take Coach Jesus H. Christ to annoint6 him with miraculous improvement. In other words, it ain’t gonna happen for this kid. He’s just too slow and you an’t teach speed.

    As for Costner, his is a will issue. He needs to get fired up and hungry for every game the way that he did at the end of the 06/07 campaign. That’s on him.

    On the other hand, Smith is improving in my opinion. Hickson got better during his short time in Raleigh.

  9. brodywolf 12/15/2008 at 10:55 AM #

    I’m pretty sure that, considering the recruits we have coming next year, Lowe will keep his job unless we don’t win an ACC game. Having been a lifelong wolfpacker (30+ years)and alumni, I remember the days when we didn’t worry about having to depend on next year’s recruits to make us feel better about this year. It will not be fun living in Greenville if we find a way to lose to the Pirates in basketball again. That truely was an embarassing point in NC State basketball. Question- If you were John Wall or Derrick Favors, and we lost to ECU at home, would you want to come to Raleigh next year?

  10. Sweet jumper 12/15/2008 at 11:13 AM #

    I would be thrilled with Wall and/or Favors even if they are one and doners. I would much rather have them than JUCO players to bridge the gap while the other newcomers mature.

  11. choppack1 12/15/2008 at 11:22 AM #

    Alpha – you may be right. Of course, this begs the question – why did the staff bring in a PG w/ such physical limitations. You’re right, you can’t fix short and slow, but there are other areas where a kid can improve. Has his shooting improved? Has his ball handling and decision making improved?

    Regarding Costner – I can’t call it. He seems to be playing harder this year, but still hasn’t gotten his stroke back.

    Regarding Smith – I’d like to see if his FT% improves and if his defense improves enough for him to earn significant minutes. Even last year, when he got playing time, he was usually very effective on the offensive end. The good news is that it still looks like he’s in good shape.

  12. Gene 12/15/2008 at 11:35 AM #

    “assuming Degand can man the point guard position for a majority of minutes and that his play returns to the level is was just before he hurt his knee last seasn.”

    Big IF: can Degand return to form? Degand wasn’t a world beater PG, while he was playing. He physically has more upside than Javi and was starting to “get it”, but at this point Javi is by far the more experienced player.

  13. VaWolf82 12/15/2008 at 11:38 AM #

    Of course, this begs the question – why did the staff bring in a PG w/ such physical limitations.

    I don’t think that we have talked about this issue all that much around here…but there are a limited number of reasons why you would sign a lightly-recruited PG in the spring. One of those reasons is that at least one of the two transfers you had to bring in (because there were exactly zero PGs on the roster), weren’t going to make the grade. There are of course other possibilities, but this one seems the most likely.

  14. Alpha Wolf 12/15/2008 at 11:51 AM #

    Gene, Degand was adequate handling and distributing the ball, but his defense was a lot better than Javi’s. He had a lot of lateral quickness, which serves a backcourt player very well when he is on D.

    The only guy I have seen Javi handle on D very well was Greg Paulus in Raleigh last year. The rest of the time he’s reminded me more of Greg Golden’s pass defense than anything. One of my friends calls Javi “Speedy Gonzales” with a very sarcastic tone to his voice. Ignoring the politically-incorrect implied racism (which I don’t buy) he has a really good point.

    As to the “why” of bringing in a lightly recruited PG, I think VaWolf hits it on the head. There was no one left to pick from and Lowe didn’t have any prior relationships with prep kids to draw upon.

    Bottom line is this: as go State’s PG’s, so goes the team. Right now, we just don’t have the caliber of PG to be a consistently solid team.

  15. SuperStuff 12/15/2008 at 12:11 PM #

    Marques Johnson really hurt us. That kid had the perfect opportunity to take over at PG last year and failed. Highly recruited player and for whatever reason could barely get the ball over half court. The kid had zero confidence in his game and it showed.

    Not offering Chris Warren was a huge mistake because that guy was a beast last year in the SEC.

  16. happypackdad 12/15/2008 at 12:22 PM #

    The team will be much better when FD comes back. Javi is a good back-up PG. Mayes will get better each season. This team will be fine once healthy, at min a NIT bid.

  17. wufpup76 12/15/2008 at 12:26 PM #

    “assuming Degand can man the point guard position for a majority of minutes and that his play returns to the level is was just before he hurt his knee last seasn.”

    ^I don’t think you can count on this happening … If it does happen at all, we’d probably be pretty well into conference play – for whatever that’s worth

    From what I’ve seen, *if* Gonzo and Mays can show steady, marked improvement throughout the season this team has shown flashes that it could be a bubble team or more (I said flashes, not definitely)

    That’s just it though, our Point Guard play is a HUGE *IF* … Javi to me is improved from last season – take that as scary or good if you like … BUT, he has handled the team with a lot more confidence except for the Davidson game, which makes it debateable about him being able to cut it in ACC play … He’ll have to prove it though, and I’m not sure Farnold will ever be the same – very unfortunate

    No doubt Javi struggled against Davidson and got a little out of control sloppy against WSSU … Mays has shown that he doesn’t respond well to high pressure while handling the ball as of yet, and Degand has looked lost on defense while trying to come back from injury … That said, it’s up to these guys to get us to wherever we’re going to go this season – be it bad or good

    As Friedlander said though, there have been positive signs … The team plays nothing like the plodding, maddening unit of last season – other than lapses in rebounding … Offensive efficiency has been way up as guys have really shared the ball and Javi and Julius have for the most part helped the team move the ball really well in halfcourt sets … But, this was against some less than stellar competition

    Either way, this is the best article I’ve seen written on this season’s squad yet … It acknowledges the good and the bad, and the potential to go one way or the other based on this season, not last

  18. BJD95 12/15/2008 at 12:44 PM #

    I summarized lots of this in the offseason PG analysis piece, but here’s the Cliffs Notes version:

    – Javi’s game is based on speed, but he’s not at all fast. Thus, he looked great playing against Paulus, but awful against most everyone else. It’s telling that both Davidson and SC State thought they could pressure him into TOs (which they did).

    – Javi’s size is also a huge defensive liability (again, unless he’s guarding Paulus).

    – State needs at least a 90% healthy Degand to have a chance in hell. He doesn’t distribute the ball very well, but if reasonably healthy, he can get the ball across halfcourt without help and be a plus defender (two things that Javi will never, ever do).

    – Big problem – I don’t think Degand will ever come back at 90%. Thus, we have no shot at the dance and can only hope to avoid disaster.

    – Based on what little action I’ve seen, I wouldn’t be surprised if Mays starts to get more minutes. There is at least some chance he can develop into a decent backup/emergency starter.

    – The 2009-10 PG will either be Lo Brown or John Wall. Harrow will start at the point from the minute he arrives on campus.

    – Lowe signed Javi because he felt he had to have another PG, pretty much any PG, on the roster. It was a desperation movem and as I noted last February, it happened during the time when Lowe didn’t know what he was doing (and Towe was not a wise choice for a mentor, IMHO).

    – This year is for improving intangibles and recruiting (and is how I will judge Sid this year). Results must at least be pretty good next season, and his 5th team needs to be one we can all be excited about – or he is doomed to fail.

  19. redfred2 12/15/2008 at 12:49 PM #

    “What you don’t expect is for returning starters to regress like we saw last year.”

    Why not? We definitely DID see regression occurring, and on more than one occassion, under the previous regime.

    I don’t think Fowler would budge anyway, and this time I agree with him. Sidney Lowe has finally found a way to perk true interest in the NC State BB program once again, and he’s making headway with the type of essential talent that we’ve been missing for WAAAAAAYYYYY too long around here already. If you guys want to throw in the towel and lose the momentum, along with losing another batch much more talented recruits to other universities, because of the legal precedence that was set IN RALEIGH during the last coaching change, then go ahead and be impatient all you want. Just be willing to wait another seven or eight years for ANYBODY to come in here and start showing any REAL improvement in the program after Lowe is gone.

  20. wufpup76 12/15/2008 at 12:51 PM #

    “Bottom line is this: as go State’s PG’s, so goes the team.”

    DING, DING.

    Any judgement of Sidney needs to take the PG situation into account

    On the plus, Engin was no true point guard, but had the skill set and basketball knowledge to be really effective … Do you give more credit to Engin or Sidney here – or some credit to each?

    On the negative, Sidney hasn’t quite been able to settle the PG position just yet over this season and last (you can’t possibly include his first season – Thanks Lee for leaving him so much time to prepare and recruit)

    Farnold’s situation is a typical unfortunate N.C. State injury … I love Javi, but he has to step it up against better competition … Julius is definitely a true point guard, but has a long way to go in his game

    The question(s) is (are), how much do you fault Sidney for the current PG situation given his non-existent first year of recruiting (thanks again, Lee) and how much time does he get to fix it with “his recruits” ?

    I’ve said all along that I’m willing to give him his 4 years for at the very least he came back to us and has at least tried to bail us out of a bungled coaching search and a program that hadn’t had a true point guard in what, 8 years (Gainey)?

    If this season and next are disappointments, does he get another season based on the way recruiting is going? That’s dealing in the hypothetical though, and is pretty much useless right now

    ***

    It’s just my opinion, but I actually disagree about Chris Warren … He is very talented, but is a true “shoot first, pass as the last option” point guard, which I’m unsure if Sidney really wanted

    With sincere apologies to our friend Everett Beez as I know he likes Ole Miss, I’ve seen Ole Miss a couple of times this season and don’t really like the way they play … Warren and Huertas (their starting backcourt) are both talented, but shoot every chance there is – there are no real looks to the inside nor focus on ball movement … I really can’t stand that style of play and am glad Sidney generally prefers a pass first point guard … Perhaps this line of thinking is why Andy Kennedy hated V so bad … who knows

  21. redfred2 12/15/2008 at 12:57 PM #

    As far as the reports of being NCAA tournament material, I look for rawl desire from the players first and foremost, and I just don’t see it in these guys.

  22. Alpha Wolf 12/15/2008 at 12:57 PM #

    We all know Lowe isn’t going anywhere, and at this point, nor should he. That’s why I laugh when I read articles about him being in hot water this season…when a writer puts ink to that idea, s/he’s showing a distinct lack of understanding about the way that NC State sports work.

    Thing is, Lowe came in under a dark cloud, because the perception was that the previous regime was doing a great job and the only reason that fans wanted a change was because they were jealous of Duke and Carolina. That may be true, to some extent, but I think that State has some of the most knowledgeable and passionate basketball fans in the whole scope of the college game. They certainly know good basketball and they can certainly identify a player getting better and better as he plays through his eligibility. They can also tell you when they see boneheaded moves from the bench. But we were just jealous of the Heels and the Blue Debbils. Right.

  23. Gene 12/15/2008 at 1:00 PM #

    On a side note, Sid inherited a whopping 6 scholarship players, two years ago. Not six, who are still with the team, but six total. Herb hadn’t come close to using up our scholly limit the last few years he was here, and regularly started the season with 2-3 walk-ons on the bench. This never seemed to have a big impact on the team – 2-3 walk-ons not getting minutes, versus 2-3 scholly guys not getting minutes – because he didn’t have a deep rotation and had been able to get some solid recruiting classes in to replenish any departures on the team during those years.

    Of course when we lost 2/3’s of an incoming recruiting class and lost several starters to graduation, we were caught with our pants down and didn’t have enough bodies to adequately fill out a rotation.

    Sid & Co. are, in some ways, forced to rebuild a program from the ground up, which did have some success under the previous regime. It’s really hard to figure out what to make of Sid, right now, because he did beat expectations his first year and was awful last year.

    One thing I can assume is it will take a few years to build up the talent level in this program again, unless we can land a great 5-6 player recruiting class next year and keep the top guys from that class for more than a single season.

    The real issue is how much rope will we be wiling to give Sid and how much will we wish we had, so we could hang ourselves (figuretively speaking of course) and be put out of our misery.

    “Not offering Chris Warren was a huge mistake ”

    If I remember correctly we didn’t offer him, because we thought Chris Wright had recommitted to us, only to lose him to Georgetown at the last minute.

  24. Wulfpack 12/15/2008 at 1:16 PM #

    I have nothing to add other than I have vowed to be a patient Wolfpack fan considering the circumstances Sid inherited. That does not mean that I don’t expect to see some improvement both from the team as well as the coaching staff. It’s getting to be about time to start seeing something tangible — an identity if you wish, b/c right now we don’t have one. We’re just another average team.

    But as far as this talk goes with the prospects of Sid’s time in Raleigh hanging in limbo, it’s non-sense. For one, LF won’t do a damn thing if we are even half-way decent, which I think we are. And two, I don’t think pulling the plug even after a terrible year this year (which I do not think will happen) and next will do anything for our program. Talk about moving backwards.

    This is Sid’s program. It’s his time and he is going to need the all the time he can get. The future of our program is in his hands and it can go any which way. But I like the guy (even though I want to see him develop more tactical coaching skills), have zero doubt he loves the school, and I think in the end he can pull us through — it just may not be as quickly as we all had hoped or expected. That’s ok with me as long as we get there. But we can’t give up on the guy b/c I do think he has it in him and I think he will get the kind of players he needs to be successful.

  25. kyjelly 12/15/2008 at 1:35 PM #

    burnbarn- 2011? Why so soon? We needed a point guard these past 2 years! Sid gets a pass his first year for not finding one. And if one is forced to build a program from the ground up,one of the firsst things you go get is someone to run your program a point guard!

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