Pack Plays Well For an ENTIRE HALF! (Duke 92, NC State 72)

And naturally, we end the game down twenty and in complete surrender mode on defense. Have some pride to wear the uniform, and at least hit somebody if you don’t want to get into defensive or rebounding position. But don’t stand there holding your junk while a guy drives for an uncontested layup.

Not that I’m surprised, mind you. But that doesn’t stop me from being pissed.

About BJD95

1995 NC State graduate, sufferer of Les and MOC during my entire student tenure. An equal-opportunity objective critic and analyst of Wolfpack sports.

07-08 Basketball NCS Basketball

146 Responses to Pack Plays Well For an ENTIRE HALF! (Duke 92, NC State 72)

  1. beowolf 02/01/2008 at 9:50 AM #

    Just stand back; noah’s on a roll.

    And you’re all f$#@ing g$#d#$E@# idiots if you disagree, of course. Bet we won’t win another f#@$ing game this season till we send Lowe back to the f#@$ing ghetto where his a$$ belongs, etc., etc. We won’t win a D1 game in football in 2007 either.

  2. BJD95 02/01/2008 at 9:55 AM #

    I like how noah makes me feel like a cockeyed optimist.

    A few weeks ago, someone said that Lowe’s coaching tenure will more or less depend on whether he signs John Wall. With each passing game, I lean more towards agreeing with that.

  3. decwolfpack 02/01/2008 at 10:01 AM #

    Noah, you make it sound like we are wrong to criticize the refs. It is wrong to criticize the refs when your team had a game that was called fairly and you lose but that wasn’t the case last night. We lost by 20, with Duke shooting 3’s that is less than 7 possessions of the ball. Turnovers due to lack of calling fouls that lead to wide open 3’s on the break or lack of defense due to our players argueing a bad call which they shouldn’t do can make the game get out of hand real quick with a team like Duke. When we have no shot attempt or a shot contested with contact and it fuels their break,it is common sense that they will come out on top. The refs do come into play in how they call the game. If you don’t think they do maybe the NCAA should just start having games with no officials and let the teams make their own calls. I still think my group of guys that I play 4 on 4 with on Monday nights call our games more fairly than the ACC referees. If I foul someone, I call it on myself and I expect someone to admit if they foul me. If someone walks, we call it, if someone goes over the back, we call it.

  4. BJD95 02/01/2008 at 10:04 AM #

    Criticizing the refs last night reminds me of that Bible verse about “pointing out the speck in your neighbor’s eye while ignoring the plank in your own.” Our team’s own problems are far more serious than the officiating, and focusing on that minor issue seems like an excuse to ignore much more significant problems.

  5. LRM 02/01/2008 at 10:07 AM #

    I remember when Damien Wilkins was the next David Thompson.

    I haven’t given a damn about recruiting since.

  6. Noah 02/01/2008 at 10:18 AM #

    You know, if this were the ONLY game that I heard a bunch of wimps whining about the refs, I’d overlook it.

    You guys aren’t even aware that you do it.

    And beo, I never said Lowe needs to go back to the ghetto (wherever that is). He just needs to get fired so he’ll go back to the NBA (a fate I’m reluctant to wish on anyone). Furthermore, I don’t think everyone’s an idiot….just deeply, DEEPLY in denial.

    But hey, make it about me. That’s what junkies usually do.

  7. WIFF 02/01/2008 at 10:21 AM #

    Pretty disappointing second half. We showed that we could dominate them inside so K goes small and we can’t guard the perimeter. Good coaching IMO. I was at the game, in the middle of the supposed “cameron crazies”, and they are the least knowledgeable basketball fans I have ever seen. They actually wanted a foul called on Costner after Paulus intentional assault on him. Their favorite chant to us is “Big High School” which is supposed to mean that State is like a big high school? Yeah, I don’t get it either. It was pretty funny to see them so pissed off at the half that they all ripped off their green shirts and threw them on the court. Even after the announcer asked them not to.
    There were some positives from our team but the lack of fight in the second half is disappointing. I don’t think pinning our hopes for this season on beating UNC or Duke is a good idea. Let’s just try to beat the ACC teams that aren’t ranked in the top 5 and we can have a succesful season.

  8. BJD95 02/01/2008 at 10:23 AM #

    Let’s not make this personal, guys. Please.

  9. decwolfpack 02/01/2008 at 10:26 AM #

    This is my first day ever posting on any NC State message board. So, I am not a regular offender of criticizing the refs. It was so blatant last night that I felt compelled to vent my frustration this morning.

  10. cjt 02/01/2008 at 10:28 AM #

    Couldn’t agree more with BJD95. This team has much bigger problems then worrying about whether K’s boys were getting away with murder on D and the benefit of phantom calls. This team is either poorly coached from an X’s and O’s standpoint OR is full of complete morons who have no concept of what it takes to beat good, disciplined, well coached opponents. A consistent effort for 40 minutes, good decision making on both offense and defense, and a gameplan that exploits the opponent’s weaknesses and emphasizes yours. The first half shows what happens when this is adhered to…the second illustrates what playground ball looks like against a well-oiled machine. In football, when you abandon the run in panic cause you’re down by 2 touchdowns, the game is pretty much over when you get pick-6ed and you get blown out. Its no different in basketball…when you start settling for contested jumpshots and ill-advised 3’s instead of continuing the inside game, you’re done. This season we have settled to often and gotten blown out of the gym.

  11. beowolf 02/01/2008 at 10:29 AM #

    Oh please, noah, if you come in calling people names, it’s really bad form to answer the responses with “make it about me.”

    Things I complained about last night: point guards turning the ball over, Fells’ bricked dunk, Pack not stopping Duke’s run, poor officiating, NC State appearing to give up.

    Lawdamercy, I sound like a fan.

  12. triadwolf 02/01/2008 at 10:29 AM #

    I didn’t particularly like the officiating myself, but the fact of the matter is we left at least 10-12 points on the table by missing foul shots during the first 8-10 minutes of the second half. It’ a different ball game going into the last 10 minutes if we just make 70% of those.

    That being said, we should have also played much better defense. But who expects a team to vitually hit 100% of their 3’s – open or not. Cudos to Duke for making the open shots, we had our opportunites and missed those shots in the second half. No surprise there, we cannot consistantly hit the open jumper especially with Fells being a non-factor.

  13. burnbarn 02/01/2008 at 10:33 AM #

    How many times did dook fail to score on a possession in the second? If it is more than twice, then I would be shocked.

    The kicked ball no call was a very bad sequence for us. Notonly were they scoring everytime, but we took 2 wide open 3s and they just didn’t go down. I looked at the wife and i said ‘ball game’. Man dook was raining 3s in the 2nd…of course we were not challenging those shots at all by going behind the screens and such. I guess the refs should have called that.

    It was nice to see us play a good first half for a change.

  14. Dr. BadgerPack 02/01/2008 at 10:37 AM #

    I’m mildly curious as to why littering the court with ANYTHING doesn’t merit a technical foul.

    Then again, I’m also curious as to why Costner wasn’t T’d up after his swing-and-a-miss after the Paulus tackle attempt. Hell, Hansborough was T’d up for that against us last year.

    All around, there is absolutely no debating the officiating was pretty horrid across the board. More went against us than for us. It doesn’t mitigate our piss-poor second half or inability to compensate for “official bias”– if I’m coaching baseball and the umpire won’t give the corners, I tell the catcher to move his bloody glove!

    Still, officiating didn’t cost the game– it sucked as bad in the first half as it did in the second, and I recall us “winning” the first half by 9 points. In the second half, we were obliterated by wide open 3s coming off of screens (I recall someone mentioning that yesterday) and plagued by mental mistakes that have bothered us over the course of the season.

    Summary: State lost. The officiating was horrible. Those are the facts in evidence.

  15. Noah 02/01/2008 at 10:40 AM #

    cjt, THANK you.

  16. beowolf 02/01/2008 at 10:51 AM #

    Badger, you are correct; certainly you can’t pin a 29-point swing on officiating. The team went to la-la land in the second half. Duke exposed all our faults. These opinions certainly found expression on SFN among everything else.

    The officiating was just salt in the wounds, keen extra stinging on top of all the gaping wounds. It’s not surprising that folks complained. Just so, when Julius Caesar said “Et tu, Bruté,” he wasn’t blaming Brutus solely for his murder, his was just the most unkindest cut of all.

    Great, I just cited Shakespeare over a basketball game. I am regressing into a comfort zone.

    This game saw good and bad aspects of NC State. Can they learn from what they did well, or do they retreat over their long, hard fall? I said before that this game reminded me of last year’s game at Georgia Tech. In the short run, their loss didn’t translate into “pissed off” wins afterward. In the long run, it seems, the coaches were able to build on what they did well at GT. I hope that they can build on the first half vs. Duke — we had excellent team play, excellent bench help, and good adherence to the game plan.

  17. choppack1 02/01/2008 at 10:54 AM #

    It’s as if some of you can’t see that there CAN BE MORE THAN ONE FRIGGIN’ PROBLEM.

    I saw lots of problems out there on the court. I think the officiating was about as bad as our second half.

    Is that a reasonable thing to say?

    I don’t know if the officiating cost us the game, but it sure as hell made a loss more likely. That said – you will get screwed when you play in Cameron. The coach and players need to deal w/ it. They need to take a lesson from UMd’s teams that manned up there.

    I’ve seen improvement from our team this year – and I think that unlike the game in Chapel Hill earlier – if we had gotten some key calls, who knows what would have happened.

    Bottum line – our guys need to get tougher. But I’d also tell you that if I’m Lee Fowler I’m demanding a friggin explanation of how Duke got away w/ what they did.

  18. nycfan 02/01/2008 at 10:57 AM #

    If Lowe’s career hinges on Wall, he may be in serious trouble, not b/c Wall is not the real thing (by all accounts, he is a solid top 10-15 player), but b/c of the relevant time frame.

    BY looking ahead to Wall, I think you are assuming that this season will end with an NIT bid. Wall will be a HS senior NEXT year, when State will be cobbling together a backcourt from Fells, Degand, Javi, Johnson and top 150 freshman combo Mays. Not sure whether the redshirt kid is more a wing or inside player. Grant and likely Hickson will be gone and we’ll have to see if, as the man by default, Costner rediscovers his love of basketball. Not an ideal formula for next season but not a certain NIT or worse year, either.

    Then, the FOLLOWING season, IF you land Wall, you will have lost Costner, McCauley & Fells and I’m certain by then Hickson. So Wall will be a FRESHMAN PG with the growing pains that entails surrounded by Degand, Javi, Johnson and Mays on the perimeter and with Tracy Smith and ?? inside, so THAT could be a tough year (depending on who else is recruited in the post).

    So, it is not JUST Wall, but recruiting guys with Wall and then it is probably their SOPHOMORE season when the break-through would come.

  19. nycfan 02/01/2008 at 10:58 AM #

    ^point being, I’m not sure if Sid can make it to Wall’s sophomore year b/4 making the NCAAs

  20. triadwolf 02/01/2008 at 11:02 AM #

    I think there were more positives than negatives in this game. The second half we started off not playing as well as we could – mistakes on defense, missed foul shots – but we also had some things just not go our way. We had a couple of 3’s halfway down and out, had rebounds in our hands that went the other ways, etc. It really just kind of snowballed; then you throw in Duke’s intensity and not missing any shots… I think we fought hard until about the 5 minute mark; we may not have played well, but we did not quit the very end and by that point they were just emotionally spent. Overall it was the best team ball we played all year by far.

    BTW – I was at the game and believe me when I say that Duke whined and complained plenty about EVERY foul and play that did not go their way. There were even a few Duke fans around me that got a little annoyed by it.

  21. wufpup76 02/01/2008 at 11:08 AM #

    “Honestly, times like this, Sid should have a goon on the bench who can get suspended- and you hurt a Duke player. Not injure, but hurt. Let the conference know you aren’t going to get punked. If other teams did that as well, eventually you’d get fairer calls.

    We need a goon.”

    my friend and i were saying the EXACT same thing last night … even in the first half we were both saying how we needed to pull a john cheney (temple) to send a message

    when teams think you are soft and that you fold to the first sign of distress then they will continue to punk you until YOU stand up to it and do something about it … it’s clear that this nc state team has developed it’s own soft, fold to any raise reputation … until you man up and send a message teams will just continuously try to belittle you

    i honestly think that duke thought the game was over last night after nelson’s early dunk made it 4-2 … you could see that their game plan was to send a message early that state isn’t anywhere as good as us so don’t even try … after that dunk i believe they thought the message was sent and we would politely roll over … when we responded and hit them back i think duke was shocked and the result was a 9-pt. halftime lead … my favorite part of the first half was when that pretty boy d**khead henderson dunked and immediately turned and started barking at gavin … i knew he had made a mistake b/c gavin wouldn’t just take that sh*t, and lo and behold, gavin went off until the refs checked him out of the game … i love gavin grant

    second half, different story … you could clearly see penis, i mean paulus, get into javi’s head and the rest of the team just wilt to the pressure … i hope this game leaves a bad taste in our player’s mouths and they’ll be angry and motivated b/c of it … they allowed themselves to get punked in half 2 and they know it … i hope they respond w/ anger instead of just the ol’ “it’s over now, let’s chop some wood” BS

    sidney clearly argues w/ the refs more than mr. chopping wood ever would (it’s called standing up for your team, mr. woodchopper), but i do wish that sidney would have gotten a technical later in the 2nd half or told the team to send a clear and resolute message … we’re not ANYONE’S rival until we have the fight and the belly for it, and sometimes that includes throwing a cheapshot or two to let the other team know that they don’t own you and can’t do anything they want to you

    i’ve never really wanted anyone intentionally hurt on a court, but that started to change last night w/ that punk paulus … by the end of the game i wasn’t even watching the action anymore, i was just HOPING that ferguson or harris would go clothesline the little b*tch and see how he liked his own medicine … if other team’s players and coaches are upset b/c you’re willing to fight w/ them for yourself and your teammates that’s a GOOD thing … we shouldn’t be out there to be punked, we should be out there to win … i’m all for good sportsmanship especially when you’re losing, but when the other team is practically waving their collective d*cks in your face then it becomes something else and it’s time to do something about about it

    no more p**sy sh*t please … go state

  22. Clarksa 02/01/2008 at 11:11 AM #

    “^point being, I’m not sure if Sid can make it to Wall’s sophomore year b/4 making the NCAAs”

    Have you forgotten who’s in control of the athletic department? Sid will get a minimum of five years…

  23. RAWFS 02/01/2008 at 11:14 AM #

    Some good discussion, some about what one would expect.

    My take:

    I sat during halftime expecting what happened to Maryland to happen to us. It did.

    Refs didn’t cause the loss, not hitting shots and playing sound defense caused the loss. The refs just made it worse.

    Courtney Fells is going to show up on the next milk carton. He certainly went missing last night.

    Point guard problems — especially Johnson — only played into Duke’s hands. Gonzalez tried but ultimately couldn’t handle Dark Blue Hell, which should not surprise you. The guy is a reserve true freshman project not a ready-made top 20 frosh PG who spent every summer trading lunch money with his ACC opponents players in AAU and sneaker camps. Everyone says that the kid should play better – well, he’s trying – but this level of competition is newer to him than we’re willing to admit.

    Brandon Costner needs a sports psychologist.

    Sidney Lowe could have substituted a little better, or at least a lot more often.

    Tracy Smith is either hurt or in the doghouse. Me, I want a kid from Detroit playing against the Blue Devils.

    Finally: You stay classy, K Duke left a lot of its front line players in the game after State pulled their and put in Ferguson and others. Really great show of sportsmanship up 20, Mike. BTW, Mike, you make me sick when you talk about V. Quit using his name to promote yourself.

    My 0.02. YMMV. Back to work.

  24. PurplePeopleEaters 02/01/2008 at 11:17 AM #

    The crazies are really getting bad at getting in players heads. Still in High school? When costner was up they were just saying “costner.” I expect more from Duke fans, honestly.

    either way, the game was total bullshit. Our team played hard and I see great improvements in a lot of their game.

  25. waxhaw 02/01/2008 at 11:18 AM #

    Why is it that when Duke gets a long rebound, they out-hustled us. When we get a long rebound, it was a lucky bounce?

    Why is it that when we were winning in the first half, Duke wasn’t playing hard or wasn’t playing “Duke basketball”. Why wouldn’t the second half be chalked up to NC State not playing hard instead of Duke doing something well?

    Why is it that Billy Packer’s idiocy is topped only by Dick Vitale?

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