Andrew Jones said a lot; N&O added to it; SFN finishes it off

On Monday we asked why should we put ourselves through the pain of typing it when Andrew Jones’ article says it all?

On Tuesday, the News & Observer chimed in with their heavy hitters.

First, Chip Alexander asked, “What is going on with the Wolfpack” and then Caulton Tudor calmly opined that “The Wolfpack isn’t hitting the panic button yet”.

As much as I appreciate the ‘faith’ that things will get better this year exhibited by both the team and Tudor I exercise my right to remain worried because of the nature of the Wolfpack’s problems. [See (1) many previous entries; (2) Jones’ article; (3) Alexander’s article]

I PRAY to God that I am wrong…but, I don’t see a switch to be flipped here for the Wolfpack to get things fixed.

If we were ‘one shooter away’ or just needed to fix our broken 3-2 zone issues then things would feel different to me. But, NC State’s problems are significantly more systemic and fundamental than items that can be fixed with some tweaks in practice or a player becoming eligible or a player finding his shooting touch.

NC State doesn’t exert much effort on the court, period. This manifests itself in literally NO defensive or rebounding effort. (And, it will manifest itself into weak home crowds as fans do not respect or invest in teams that don’t seem to care).

You can’t just flip a switch and suddenly learn how to play defense and box out. As you will see here the offense is so bad it can only improve as the team finds its groove and Ben McCauley and Porkchop Costner (hopefully) find their heads and get out of their slump.

But, what good is scoring ten more points a game if you can’t stop the least talented opponents in America from scoring?

Worse yet…if Coach Lowe can find that magical switch and get these guys on a roll…is anyone convinced that our players are in the physical condition to even execute tough defense?

Have you seen the ‘physiques’ on these guys?

A friend of mine who has been very close to the NC State – and other ACC – program(s) for the last 15 years told me that he has never seen an NC State team – and rarely seen an ACC team – with the out-of-shape bodies of this team. Did Brandon Costner live at the Golden Corral in the off-season?

Seriously…what did these guys do in the offseason? They obviously didn’t work out…and they obviously didn’t work on defense and rebounding.

Don’t misunderstand me – as Coach Lowe and Caulton Tudor believe I recognize that there is a lot of basketball to be played this year. But, I also seem to be the only one who recognizes that the season is actually 25% completed. You don’t get to play that much basketball in March when you have two horrible losses on your resume with 75% of the season ahead of you to potentially lose more.

Don’t look now…but Friday night’s home game against a Davidson team who is significantly better than their record looms as one of the biggest games in Coach Lowe’s young career. With a loss, you can legitimately put a fork in the Wolfpack until they boys find a miracle run of upsets in ACC play to at least get us back to a fighting chance. With a win, some cupcake games sprinkled with Cincy and Seton Hall provide State an opportunity to get back on track for an NCAA Tournament bid with a 9-7 ACC record (and maybe an 8-8 record with the right mix of wins and losses).

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07-08 Basketball Sidney Lowe

138 Responses to Andrew Jones said a lot; N&O added to it; SFN finishes it off

  1. ShootingGuard 12/13/2007 at 9:40 AM #

    “LMAO at Shooting Guard. Herb left Sid a solid core to build around in Fells, Grant, Costner & Ben. Sid needs to figure out how to add to that core & keep building on the foundation Herb set. No NCAA’s this year will be a discrace with the talent we have.”

    Packgrad93,

    YOU are a DISGRACE to the State fan base, although you are a Herb fan and not a State fan. Ever since Herb cried and ran away to the desert, you have done nothing but try to build up Herb’s “legacy” at Sid Lowe’s expense if necessary.

    The team Herb left Sid was only a fraction of the team Herb had in his final days—days that included a 24pt beat down at the RBC by the worst UNC team Roy will ever field, 2 complete beatdowns by the worst Wake Forest team in years—once on the ACCT stage, and a beat down by Herb’s daddy, Rick Barnes at a football school on the NCAAT stage.

    That “core” Herb left was so “solid” that they never really got to play for him. Guys not good enough to play on a team that couldn’t even keep it close against the worst Wake Forest team in years are what Sid was left with…

    One of the biggest problems with the team this year is leadership in the backcourt. After 10 years of “recruiting” and “program building”, Herb left Sid with one combo guard in the backcourt to lead the team and a shooting guard who never really got to play. Sid had to scramble to get whoever he could during the quick transition following the debacle of a coaching search that forced State to go with about the only guy out there that loved them, Sid. We are suffering this year due that shortened crisis recruiting “season.”

    It will be a disgrace if SFN allows you to keep posting here. You belong on the Arizona State blog, if they even have one…

  2. ShootingGuard 12/13/2007 at 9:48 AM #

    “Isn’t that the coach’s responsibility to inspire the players to try?”

    Yes…

    I have no idea why Herb, after 15+ years of college coaching, downplayed the games versus UNC and Duke or why he did not feel like it was important to win ACC Championships or games in the NCAA’s. It is obvious by his teams’ performances against rivals, legends, and non-conf foes that he did not inspire them at all as evidenced by Herb’s record versus El Deano, K, Roy, Providence, Tulane, Fresno State, Ohio State, Iowa, non-Duke non-UNC programs like Maryland & Wake, Vandy, Wisky, Texas, etc.

  3. ShootingGuard 12/13/2007 at 9:55 AM #

    “why, cause I don’t bash Herb?”

    No…

    Because you bash Sid. You loved Herb so much that you have done nothing but tear down Sid to help secure the virtue of your love for Herb. Sid’s year 1 was better than Herb’s year 1 because Sid brought back tradition in the red jacket and actually thinking UNC was an important opponent, then actually beating them. If Sid doesn’t get us back to the NCAA’s in year 2, he will have good company with Herb’s ACC year 2 effort. If Sid doesn’t do it by year 6, he should have been let go before that, but he won’t be alone since Herb couldn’t do it either in the ACC. Regardless, Sid should not be trashed personally if he gives it his best in trying to save the program after the worst AD in history single-handedly tried to destroy it.

  4. packgrad93 12/13/2007 at 1:03 PM #

    “you have done nothing but try to build up Herb’s “legacy” at Sid Lowe’s expense if necessary.”

    no, I have corrected myths & lies about a coach who devoted 10 years to NCSU & brought us back to respectability.

    “That “core” Herb left was so “solid” that they never really got to play for him.”

    exactly what I’m talking about. Grant played, Costner was inj, Ben & Fells were frosh behind better players.

    “or why he did not feel like it was important to win ACC Championships or games in the NCAA’s.”

    more of the lies

    “Because you bash Sid.”

    never happened. enough here do that already

  5. redfred2 12/13/2007 at 8:52 PM #

    “no, I have corrected myths & lies about a coach who devoted 10 years to NCSU & brought us back to respectability.”

    SO, if Sidney Lowe is a “great recruiter”, occasionally bringing in some fairly decent, though unbalanced, talent for the next decade, but doesn’t win any titles over those ten years, then I guess about twelve years from now you’ll be defending your ass off for Lowe also.

  6. ShootingGuard 12/14/2007 at 8:43 AM #

    ^

    Redfred,

    You would think that he would be devoted already to defending the guy who led us to our last national championship and next to last ACC Title, winning the Everett Case award along the way no less…

    But, then again, on the other blog, he slams Quinton Jackson, who led us to our very last ACC Title, in order to defend Lee Fowler…

    Apparently, Herb Sendek and Lee Fowler are greater than the program and worth defending for years on end, while the guys who actually made the program SIGNIFICANT (rather than simply “respectable”) are somehow not worth supporting or defending 7 games into year 2…

  7. packgrad93 12/14/2007 at 9:04 AM #

    “But, then again, on the other blog, he slams Quinton Jackson, who led us to our very last ACC Title, in order to defend Lee Fowler”

    how did I do that?

  8. Stoner 12/14/2007 at 9:04 AM #

    One of the biggest problems with the team this year is leadership in the backcourt. After 10 years of “recruiting” and “program building”, Herb left Sid with one combo guard in the backcourt to lead the team and a shooting guard who never really got to play. Sid had to scramble to get whoever he could during the quick transition following the debacle of a coaching search that forced State to go with about the only guy out there that loved them, Sid. We are suffering this year due that shortened crisis recruiting “season.”

    The short recruiting season for the ’08 class was compounded by losing two thirds of the ’07 recruiting class and 2/3 of the ’06 (or was it ’05) recruiting class leaving the program early, for professional sports careers.

    We are in a rebuilding mode, more so than we thought at the start of the season, due to the premature loss of talent.

    To compare Sid’s first year to Herb’s isn’t reasonable. Herb took over a program in shambles and did get us to some degree of respectability.

    Sid inherits a situation more similar to Mike Krzyzsweski (if I spelled it wrong, it’s Mikie K’s fault for not trying to spell it close to phonetically), who had a good program with little talent in the cupboard.

    The real test of Sid should be if his decission to bring in Degand and Javi, for example, who were not really recruited by major programs pays off, because if they do not we have locked up two scholarships for 3-4 more years.

    Basically does having Degand and Javi, now, outweigh the possibility of getting better talent in ’09 class, where we would have 4 open scholarships, instead of two.

    Sid’s year 1 was better than Herb’s year 1 because Sid brought back tradition in the red jacket and actually thinking UNC was an important opponent, then actually beating them.

    I forget, which UNC player hit the half court heave, but Herb came within a hair’s breath of beating Dean Smith, in their first meeting at Reynolds.

    Carolina hit a 1 in 1,000 shot to win the game.

    I truly wonder how much different Herb’s tenure would’ve been, with regards to the fanbase, if Carolina hadn’t hit a cricus shot to beat us.

    Or is the fact his first teams played Carolina tough, a left over of Robinson’s tenure, because Robinson had the second best winning percentage against Carolina of any NCSU coach. Say what you want about Les’ lack of coaching ability, but he could get NCSU up to play against Carolina.

  9. packgrad93 12/14/2007 at 9:06 AM #

    “I guess about twelve years from now you’ll be defending your ass off for Lowe also”

    & I guess you’ll be bashing him as usual

  10. redfred2 12/14/2007 at 3:58 PM #

    packgrad93,

    Herb took over a program that was admittedly in trouble at the time, but the problem is that he removed it further from it’s former greatness. Sure, he won some games, made some year end appearances, but he didn’t even worry about bringing back the NC STATE that was REALLY competitive with anybody around. He walked into a great opportunity, straightened out some of the problems, then leveled the program off at a height that was well below what true Wolfpack fans expected.

    To answer your post, I’ll admit I love Sidney Lowe, but just like right now, I am not going to be blind about his, or anybody’s, faults in coaching or playing abilities. I also know the circumstances leading up to Lowe’s hire meant that the situation he stepped into is not a great one. But, whether he reaches goal or falls flat on his face, Sidney Lowe will not down play our great rivalries and he won’t be shocked when a Wolfpack fan wants a little more than he might be producing at any time. He’s been to the top, he knows, and whether you can fathom it or not, he beat UNC and all others standing in his way, and did it while wearing an NC STATE uniform. His expectations, along with his definition of the word “respectability”, are on a much higher plane than anything you’ve ever witnessed.

  11. redfred2 12/14/2007 at 9:19 PM #

    “Redfred,

    You would think that he would be devoted already to defending the guy who led us to our last national championship and next to last ACC Title, winning the Everett Case award along the way no less…”

    Shoosting Guard, it’s fairly apparent that henly knows one or maybe State BB coaches. The name Everett Case, and all that he did for college basketball in general, probably doesn’t even ring a bell,

  12. redfred2 12/14/2007 at 9:21 PM #

    ^typo “…apparent that he only knows…”

  13. ShootingGuard 12/15/2007 at 5:22 PM #

    ^

    Stoner,

    I like your reasoned defense of Herb—it is a refreshing change from the Herb lover dogma that apparently relies on trashing Pack legends like Sid and making Herb’s successes out to be way more than they ever were.

    I said when Sid was hired that I didn’t know how he would turn out, that I thought he could do ok but that building a program takes a lot of luck at the start to get that all important momentum that carries over into crucial wins and recruiting success that brings more wins.

    Herb Sendek never had an ounce of luck. Had he gotten Al Harrington or the Schea Cotton recruiting fiasco had gone differently or a few select shots had dropped in those early years or whatever, things could have been totally different. But, after a decade of just being good enough to get your hopes up, before blowing big games versus UNC, Maryland, and Duke, it was time for a change. Just because you make a decent wage at XYZ company, doesn’t mean you can’t aspire for more…

    No one should doubt that Herb did some good things for the program. Nobody should doubt that Herb can coddle together enough wins to get to the tournament and do so regularly at ASU like he started doing at State. What he does at ASU, however, has no relevance to State or the coaching change because Herb didn’t do anything great on the most prominent basketball stage of the ACC after a decade of opportunity. If David Cutcliffe wins some games at Duke, that will not change the fact that he could not hack it on the greatest stage of college football in the SEC.

    All that matters with regard to coaching right now is that fans wanted more than simply getting enough wins to show up at the NCAA’s and bring home zero ACC hardware or NCAA hardware. Sid Lowe is the coach who took the job, one of the few who persued the job with vigor. Sid should be given more than 1 season and 8 games to prove himself. Sid will need to have better luck than Herb Sendek had at State early on, but, in the end, once given enough time to reasonably evaluate, Sid will be let go if he fails—or crowned if he succeeds. People who crowned the Red Blazer last year were too early. Folks who are tearing apart every word Sid says this season are too early also.

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