Comparisons to Wolfpack Past

Fresh off Sidney Lowe’s first Raleigh Caravan, our blogging minds have turned back to basketball – particularly, Wolfpack retro. As a fun off-season exercise, a few of us brainstormed about rough comparisons of the 2007-08 roster to Wolfpackers of the past. Please share your own comps and thoughts in the comments section below. Our memories are very sketchy before the early 80s, so we are counting on the collective wisdom of our readership to cover prior decades.

– Degand = Cliff Crawford, Kelsey Weems
– Fells = Ernie Myers, Cam Bennerman, Scooter Sherrill
– Grant = Ishua Benjamin, Ernie Myers, Brian Howard, Jeremy Hyatt
– Horner = Walker Lambiotte, Andy Kennedy, Ilian Evtimov
– Smith = Brian Howard, Levi Watkins, Lorenzo Charles
– Costner = Thurl Bailey, Kenny Carr, Tom Gugliotta
– McCauley = Chucky Brown, Kevin Thompson, Evtimov/Todd Fuller hybrid (passing and low-post moves)
– Hickson = Chris Washburn (without the negative off-court baggage), Charles Shackleford (ditto)
– Johnson = Nate McMillan, Mickey Hinnant, Kenny Matthews, CC Harrison
– Javi = Curtis Marshall, Lakista McCuller
– Thomas = Cam Bennerman, smaller Kenny Carr, Brian Howard

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121 Responses to Comparisons to Wolfpack Past

  1. TNCSU 05/10/2007 at 10:00 AM #

    ^^I think he did

    I hope he qualifies, as I think he’ll be a nice addition, but not a big requirement for next year, as I think we’ll be okay in the 3-4 spot.

  2. redfred2 05/10/2007 at 10:01 AM #

    noah, you researched, ALL of that can’t possibly be coming from memory, can it? If it is memory, or even 60 percent of it, I yield to your supreme brain power.

    Don’t answer that question, great post, I’m impressed either way. GOOD stuff!!!

  3. noah 05/10/2007 at 10:37 AM #

    I had the very good fortune of knowing a *lot* of people who were involved in college basketball and recruiting around 1987 to 1989 or so. I consider myself a near-expert on those classes.

    What class was Grant Hill in? Class of 1990? For some very odd reason, I know next to nothing about that one. I think that must have been the year we were on probation and couldn’t recruit…so I didn’t marinate my head in recruiting knowledge about that year.

    BTW…if you want to see something really impressive (or sad…take your pick), pick my brain about the 1983 Atlanta Braves. I can tell you the entire lineup, pitching rotation, stats, bench players, the state of the Braves’ minor league system (Miguel Sosa, Brad Kominsk, Paul Zuvella, Gerald Perry, Matt Sinatro…), and a whole bunch of specific games. I remember Joe Torre bringing in Tony Brizzolara cold against the Dodgers when he hadn’t had a chance to warm up, how RJ Reynolds OWNED the Braves pitching, how a coked-out Steve Bedrosian gave up a potentially game-winning homer to Greg Brock one day and then got bailed out when Bob Watson hit a pinch-hit two-run dinger in the bottom of the ninth. I remember Terry Forster’s “feud” with Letterman over his playing weight. I remember Claudell Washington’s hamstrings. I remember Brook Jacoby and Rick Behenna and a “player to be named later” being traded for the bucket of spit known as Len Barker and how Ted Turner tried to convince everyone that the PTBNL was NOT Brett Butler. I remember Bruce Benedict’s 20+ game hitting streak (he’s now an ACC ref, BTW). I remember Biff Pocaroba and Jerry Royster and Terry Harper. I remember when Dodgers had a backup catcher named Jack Fimple….

  4. redfred2 05/10/2007 at 10:40 AM #

    I remember…Raisin Bran.

  5. CedarGroveWolf 05/10/2007 at 10:44 AM #

    “I hope he qualifies, as I think he’ll be a nice addition, but not a big requirement for next year, as I think we’ll be okay in the 3-4 spot.”

    I agree that we’ll be ok next season if Tracy doesn’t qualify, but I get worried about after that. JJ could be one & done, Costner might make the jump too. We’d be left with Ben & Horner

  6. noah 05/10/2007 at 10:50 AM #

    Lineup

    1. Brett Butler, LF
    2. Rafael Ramirez, “SS”

  7. redfred2 05/10/2007 at 10:57 AM #

    Lineup

    spoon

    bowl

    cereal

    milk

  8. PapaJohn 05/10/2007 at 11:12 AM #

    Mr Noah, you are the master! Great information, thank you. I do remember that when he came in, we knew Corch was going to be great – that was not a surprise.

    I read in the N&O yesterday that a gentleman has compiled all of the stats from every ACC basketball game ever played, with box scores and game summaries. Unfortunately it will cost $300, but there will be cheaper, school specific versions. You sir, need that book.

  9. StateFans 05/10/2007 at 11:38 AM #

    This a fun Wolfpack history thread. Let’s not go off the rails about Sendek AGAIN.

  10. TNCSU 05/10/2007 at 11:47 AM #

    I think Noah WROTE that book!

  11. noah 05/10/2007 at 12:22 PM #

    Damn, what happened to my braves lineup card?? Ah well…

    I saw the piece about the ACC encyclopedia. I’m thinking about whether or not that would make a good investment.

  12. packsage 05/10/2007 at 8:02 PM #

    I think Cozell McQueen and Hickson are similiar in build, but complete opposites in offensive ability. Nobody mentioned Hawkeye Whitney…

  13. redfred2 05/10/2007 at 9:35 PM #

    I guess maybe it’s because Hawkeye had short range touch and operated mainly in the midrange to inside areas, nobody shoots from eight feet anymore, so there’s not much comparison to that type of play these days. He was the most consistent, and the go to guy on the team for a while there. I did love watching ol’ Hawkeye Whitney playing in a Wolfpack uniform back then though. I wonder where he is now?

  14. redfred2 05/10/2007 at 9:43 PM #

    …That’s right, I remember an earlier article on Hawkeye, about how he had struggled horribly but had turned his life around. Hope it’s still going well for him.

  15. brown pelican 05/10/2007 at 11:53 PM #

    rf2—hawkeye was coaching with phil spence at east wake about 7-10 years ago—not sure now—one more comparison to consider—mccauley’s work ethic is reminiscent of tim stoddard’s—tim played hard every game—his skill level was enhanced by this determined attitude—loved watching him compete

  16. BillyTheKid 05/11/2007 at 6:57 AM #

    I worked with Hawkeye at Durham City Parks and Rec one summer in 1993 or 1994. What a great guy! We worked Pony Baseball together and had a lot of fun. He was try to get his life back together then, but things didn’t work out real well then. If I remember right he didn’t even finish the season. He was still a really great guy to be around. I remember giving him a ride home one night in my 1979 280ZX and he told how that was the first car he went out and got after he signed with the KC Kings. He loved to talk about how much fun he had with Kenny D (of Duke) in KC. I remember thinking too how crazy it was for him to buy a 280ZX, he had the HARDEST time getting his big butt in and out of my car.

  17. zahadum 05/11/2007 at 8:00 AM #

    Hawkeye was one of those players who was fun to watch because his game continued to develop over his career. As a freshman/soph, he scored mainly on short jumpers from the baseline. But by the time he was a junior/sen, his ball handling had improved enormously, and he had perfected that dribble spin move into a jumper from the top of the circle area that was almost unstoppable at the college level.

    One of my favorite memories of Hawkeye is one he’d probably just as soon forget. When he was a senior, I played with him in a pickup game. Kenny Carr was in town, and Hawkeye drew the task of guarding him. Now he’d slimmed down some while he was here, but he was still a very big guy, probably around 225 to 230 or so. But it was like a six year old trying to guard me. Carr threw him around the gym like he was a toy. The rest of us in the game just tried our best to stay out of the way. One of the most amazing things I’ve even seen, and one of many reasons why I think Carr was the most talented player in State history. (not the most outstanding, that would be DT, of course.)

  18. noah 05/11/2007 at 9:24 AM #

    The three most-skilled players in NC State history….it’s really not even close.

    1) DT
    2) Carr
    3) Ice

    It’s a long drop to #4 in my opinion.

  19. redfred2 05/11/2007 at 9:27 AM #

    ^^I never played with Carr, but he was a great BB player. I did play with DT on more than one occasion however, and also a few other future ABA/NBA HOF’ers, in pick up games. I’d have to say that while DT may not have thrown anyone around or muscled anyone, he did totally embarrass people, made them cover their 6’10” heads and run for cover, and he put them to shame any time and every time he felt the slightest urge to do so. But it was always with a ‘no big deal’, and nonchalant demeanor, and a smile on his face after sinking a rainbow jumper from WAY, and I MEAN WAY, WAY downtown, or easily slamming over someone seven or eight inches taller than himself. The other guys there, the future/current college and professional BB players, they laughed just as much as anyone, they had no defense to stop him. They knew exactly what they were witnessing, and they were just as impressed by his talents as the rest of us lowly, and dumbfounded, amateurs.

    I guess what I’m saying is, I disagree on your “MOST” talented label. That WAS, still is the history of the ACC, and I’d vote all time, David Thompson.

  20. zahadum 05/11/2007 at 10:28 AM #

    I suppose it depends on how one defines ‘talented’. Thompson clearly had more and better refined basketball skills. But recall that Carr: a) didn’t start playing BB until a relatively late age and b) we only got to have him for 2 years. As a soph he led the league in both scoring and, at only 6′ 7″, rebounding. Imagine what he’d have been like as a senior.

    Now the king of the rainbow jumper from way downtown was, of all people, Ted Brown. Not that he hit all that many of them, but he sure loved to take them.

  21. redfred2 05/11/2007 at 10:31 AM #

    Just to clarify, I’m biased as hell I know, and there are players out there now doing some unreal stuff that DT never did. But I have to believe that if right now there was kid named David Thompson playing BB in the back yard with his brothers in Boiling Springs, NC, that he would have seen and taken note of everything going on in the game today, and with all of his ungodly physical abilities and desire to be the best, that he would still be an innovator and way ahead of any of these guys when he arrived on the scene.

    Just my opinion.

  22. zahadum 05/11/2007 at 10:36 AM #

    Oh, goodness yes. DT today with the 3 pointer, legal dunking and a 35 second clock; he’d probably average 35 ppg the one year before he went pro.

  23. redfred2 05/11/2007 at 10:37 AM #

    We only have to look as far as a 7’4″ Tommy Burleson, backed up by a scrappy 6’7″ Tim Stoddard, to see why DT really didn’t need to concern himself with rebounding while at State. I have no doubt that if there was a need, he would have more than filled it.

  24. redfred2 05/11/2007 at 10:48 AM #

    “the one year before he went pro”

    God I hate that crap soooo much now.

  25. zahadum 05/11/2007 at 10:58 AM #

    One thing, though. While I’m sure it wouldn’t have made one iota of difference to him, I can’t quite visualize DT in today’s long baggy shorts. Just doesn’t seem right.

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