No lead is safe against Lowe’s Wolfpack

Granted, the ACC season hasn’t started yet, and granted NC State does have four losses, although none of the “embarrassing” kind against an outmatched opponent. So don’t think this is a starry-eyed rah-rah post that’s blind to the Pack’s record. Instead, it’s a trend-spotting assessment of a very thin but very young Wolfpack team with an eye toward the future.

It’s an old saying, but it is that way because it has the ring of truth: a team reflects the character of its coach. That’s good news when your coach is the scrappy, resourceful and cool-headed Sidney Lowe. Going back to their first game under the new head coach, Lowe’s Wolfpack has shown a never-say-die resiliency, repeatedly charging back from deficits and frequently winning.

The following are the deficits that Lowe’s short-handed squad have overcome so far in their 10-4 pre-ACC campaign:

Wofford: 9 points (54-45) at half (winning 92-88)
Michigan: 12 points (16-4) in the first half (winning 74-67)
East Carolina: 15 points (34-19) in the first half (winning 64-57)
UNC-Greensboro: 11 points (58-47) in the second half (winning 95-93 in OT)

Of course, there was also the insufficient comeback against No. 9 Alabama, when the Wolfpack trailed by 23 in the second half but closed to within six and forced a turnover late in the game before losing by 7, 82-75. (The Pack also trailed at halftime to Gardner-Webb by three, winning 88-76.)

The lesson here is: Don’t count Sidney Lowe’s team out when they’re trailing. This team believes it can come back, and most of the time, they’re right.

General NCS Basketball Sidney Lowe

96 Responses to No lead is safe against Lowe’s Wolfpack

  1. partialqualifier 01/03/2007 at 12:50 PM #

    You guys are cracking me up.

    “Neiman isnt playing because he’s not that good.”

    No Friggin’ Kidding!! But last time I checked, Beggers cant be choosers! Coach K is playing 10 guys, and at least a couple of those guys arent that good. Valvano would play guys like Avie Lester and D’Amico when they were young and terrible just to rest guys every once in a while. When you only have 7 available bodies, it makes no sense at all to totally ignore one of them….esp when he has played up until recently. I am fully aware that Neiman is a below average player, but he played against Michigan and we won. He played against Virginia….and we almost won on the road there. I have no prejudice for playin Neiman. I dont know the kid personally, but he hustled like hell when he played. I just think it is so odd that many of us are crying/whining about guys getting tired and not playing hard defensively because of concerns of fatigue yet Neiman sits.

    I think our starters have shown to be fairly resilient and consistent. They have shown that on a good night they will be able to compete with the middle-tier teams in the ACC. I will promise you that fatigue will lose this team far more games than Neiman would playing 10 minutes or so a game. I would bet on it.

  2. NCSUwolfpack4Life 01/03/2007 at 12:51 PM #

    ^^coming from a self-proclaimed fair weather fan… your opinion really doesn’t mean much…

    With Atsur in ANY of these games, it wouldn’t have been close because our turnovers would have effectively been cut in half. Also, the other teams perimeter shooting wouldn’t be NEARLY as good against us with Atsur in the game. Our rebounding would have been up because Grant is a great rebounder when playing in position. So we would have been Cin and would have had a MUCH better chance at beating Bama (and i think we would have) with Atsur in the game. When Atsur comes back this will be a MUCH better team.

  3. NCSUwolfpack4Life 01/03/2007 at 12:52 PM #

    partialqualifier yes of course, however Duke is playing with a LEAD the majority of the time. We can’t put Nieman in when we’re getting our butts kicked or we’re just going to get them kicked even worse! My God man… have you looked at his stat lines??

  4. partialqualifier 01/03/2007 at 12:54 PM #

    ^ were we not down 15 to Michigan with Neiman in the game?

  5. NCSUwolfpack4Life 01/03/2007 at 12:55 PM #

    I mean using your logic… Hell lets put in Braxton Albritton for 10 minutes… Lets put Lewandowski in for McCauley. Hell we got more than 5 players sitting on the bench. Lets just rotate all of our walk-ons in every now in then just to get some refreshment for our starters. You can do that when you’re beating the crap out of the other team. You CAN’T do that when you’re losing.

  6. NCSUwolfpack4Life 01/03/2007 at 12:56 PM #

    yes we were and we didn’t have another option worth a damn

  7. partialqualifier 01/03/2007 at 1:01 PM #

    ^but we won the game with that option

  8. NCSUwolfpack4Life 01/03/2007 at 1:05 PM #

    not because of Nieman, but in SPITE of Nieman.. I can GAURANTEE that

  9. partialqualifier 01/03/2007 at 1:07 PM #

    Herb used this same logic for not playing Tim Wells for 3/4 of a season a few years back. We were short-handed as hell, yet inexplicably Wells sat game after game. Finally Herb caved and played Wells. The team got hot down the stretch…starters were more rested…and Wells played a key role. The point is….we play 4 games in 10 days. We cannot keep playing 4 guys for 40 minutes per game. Period. Not only will we get blown out the second half of the season, but anyone will tell you that an athletes risk for injury increases dramatically when fatigued. I just dont see the point in a season that is going nowhere to blow out guys 40+ minutes a game when you have a guy on the bench who has played important minutes this year. You are acting like State would have no chance of winning with Neiman on the floor. What was their record when he was playing? 7-3? Damn….what the hell is wrong with that?

  10. nycfan 01/03/2007 at 1:16 PM #

    I’m not a self-proclaimed fair-weather fan. I’m an open, ardent UNC fan who also loves Big 4 basketball.

    When Atsur comes back, State will be 7-deep and it should make a huge difference. OTOH, State was getting rocked by Michigan until Atsur went down, which means nothing except it is impossible to predict how State would have done with him in any other game.

    My point is not that State fans shouldn’t be jazzed about the attitude and effort of this team; it is more that EXPECTATIONS engendered by such enthusiasm might well be tempered by the reality that the come-back wins were against inferior opponents.

    And, FTR, I think the refusal to use Neiman at all now that Ferguson is available is a bit perplexing. He is a relative liability, but so is exhaustion. A few minutes in the first half might help. But so far, to me, Lowe seems to be pushing all the right buttons with this team to squeeze out every ounce of potential and then some. I’m still trying to figure out who this McCauley kid is and what happened to the stiff who played sparing minutes for Sendeck last year. Ben is a real joy to watch for any basketbal fan, IMO.

  11. Sam92 01/03/2007 at 1:32 PM #

    should we be disappointed that UNC-G took us to overtime?

    NO – the important thing about games with teams you’re supposed to beat is not whether they play you close, it’s whether you take the heat and pull out the dubya, which our guys did. speaks well of coach and team.

    the rest of the season is going to be pretty darn challenging; if we do better than 5 wins down the stretch I’ll be impressed.

    footnote: Michigan is now 12-3

  12. beowolf 01/03/2007 at 1:37 PM #

    I think I read this somewhere … wonder where it was exactly …

    So don’t think this is a starry-eyed rah-rah post that’s blind to the Pack’s record. Instead, it’s a trend-spotting assessment of a very thin but very young Wolfpack team with an eye toward the future.

    But please, by all means, write dozens of paragraphs to try to say the same thing. You know, to “correct” that misperception that wasn’t there.

  13. redfred2 01/03/2007 at 1:41 PM #

    “I sense the same optimism and elation that we all had after the win over Boston College and FSU in football.”

    Bo, exactly. Football was different, we had some overall depth and talent that should have been more competitive throughout entire season. It’s like a see saw around here, some fans are through the roof one minute then they’re being way too critical the next. Especially when we’re talking about an out manned basketball team. We win good games by playing our butts off, some of them against lesser programs with much deeper benches, and the next you hear it’s NCAA tournament time, or we need to beat an absolutely loaded UNC team to be legit.

    This is not even anywhere close to the best top to bottom grouping of talent that NC State has had assembled at any time in recent years, but they are already playing harder and getting more out of what they have, then any of the other teams in recent memory.

    I do not understand why can’t people just enjoy that without building expectations, and setting themselves up for a let down, at such an early stage.

  14. BoKnowsNCS71 01/03/2007 at 1:55 PM #

    ^Agree. Sit back and let the season progress. Don’t live and die with the games this year or it will be a nerve wracking year for fans.

    When we lose, think next year and thereafter — it will be better and better. Losing this year is not the end of days.

    When we win, enjoy it. If we get a a big upset win — that’s gravy — enjoy that and relish it. Give a dookie or UNX fans some grief.

  15. partialqualifier 01/03/2007 at 1:56 PM #

    Redfred….I agree whole-heartedly with your last paragraph. I am still shocked when I hear some of my friends claiming that State is gonna “shock the world!” If we win 6 games I will be shocked! LOL!

  16. ShootingGuard 01/03/2007 at 3:08 PM #

    NYCFan,

    Although I see your points to some extent, I am still not totally sure what the point is with all of that…pissing on a wet blanket??

    This team was picked to finish last in the ACC and opposing fans everywhere (yourself not included, I hope) were gloating about how this might be the worst team in ACC history, losing to all kinds of no name teams in embarrassing fashion…

    Well, through some excellent coaching and great heart on the part of a handful of guys playing nearly 40 minutes a night, no matter what this team does the rest of the season, it will NOT lose to a no name team (unlike several other ACC teams picked ahead of them have done). This team will, fortunately, NOT have a Campbell game to remember.

    I thought THAT was the point of this blog—nothing more, nothing less—to recognize that, despite the short bench and the major injury and even foul trouble, this coach and this team hasn’t quit and has found a way to win 10 of 14 games before the ACC really gets going when most of the “experts” and gleeful opposing fans predicted that this team would be lucky to win 9 games total—all of these predictions BEFORE Atsur’s injury (and some even made those predictions thinking Brackman was going to play).

    As it is, this team hasn’t been eliminated from anything yet—and that’s nice considering from where these guys have come…

    Goal 1 for me coming in was to win the no name games…Mission Accomplished!!

    Goal 2 was to win some OOC games—and ACC games—that we shouldn’t…Michigan counts, but I was hoping for more. Playing WVU as tough as UConn did is no consolation. Would like to have a do-over on that Cincy game and a few more minutes vs Bama…

    Goal 3 is to win enough to get to the NIT…We’ll see how it goes from here…

    Goal 4 is to win enough to get back to the NCAA—and tell Greg Doyel and all of the naysayers to kiss our collective ass!! Here’s hoping…

    Etc

    Etc

    Etc

    So far, so good. Could have been better, but can get better quick with a win vs BC on Saturday…

  17. NCSUwolfpack4Life 01/03/2007 at 3:55 PM #

    Well if you’re a UNC fan, your opinion means even less than a fair-weather fan…

    There’s nothing wrong with playing Nieman when we’re up. But you CANNOT play Nieman if you have someone else you can put into the rotation (ie Ferg) when you’re down or its a close game. It’s good to get the guys a rest when we’re ahead, and I’m sure if we get ahead you’ll see Nieman get some minutes. However, putting Nieman in and risking the game because you want to get someone a rest is unacceptable.

    Win and win at all costs

  18. NCSUwolfpack4Life 01/03/2007 at 4:08 PM #

    And yes, we were 7-3 with Nieman on the floor. Against INFERIOR competition… and what did Nieman do when he was on the floor. Nothing absolutely nothing. He doesn’t shoot, he can’t pass well, he’s not a good dribbler, he plays average defense. The one thing he can do is hustle and thats because he can’t do anything else. And all of that is against INFERIOR competition. What do you think is going to happen to him in ACC play? Do you REALLY think he can play against ACC caliber competition? Absolutely not. If you put Nieman in against the WORST scholarship player in the ACC, he will get absolutely ABUSED. Not just scored on, but ABUSED.

  19. Mike 01/03/2007 at 4:34 PM #

    This may not be the place, but since talking about Sid and the heart of this team, I think it fits. No way we are 10-4 without Sid. More importatly, we are playing exciting basketball, win or lose, the games are fun again.

    Looking at some other school in the Pac-10, that team is now 6-7. They struggle shooting the ball and still hoist up too many 3’s. They shoot 3’s 40% of the time, and hit less than 33% of the threes. The games they have won – they shot fairly from 3. The games they have lost – they stunk from the 3 line. Sounds familiar. Long scoring droughts are common.

    I am thrilled Sid is here and it may not be fair to compare, but this team would be 2-12 without Sid. Someone wrote earlier where was McCauley last year – now that he can play basketball he is a beast. Never had the chance last year. Give Sid the talent that had been here and I know we would have seen different (for the better) results. 5 straight NCAA’s – with Sid, we might have seen some final fours and conference champsionships too.

  20. Gene 01/03/2007 at 4:35 PM #

    What do you think is going to happen to him in ACC play?

    Didn’t Nieman play a lot of minutes against UVa?

    I agree he’s probably not talented enough to do a lot, but he did what he could do, when he got the opportunity and didn’t hurt us.

    I understand he might not be able to really contribute, but he’s worked hard and done what the coaching staff has asked of him.

    There’s no reason to rip into him.

  21. cpwolfpackfan 01/03/2007 at 4:43 PM #

    everyone lay off of nieman, and lay off of lowe as well. Lets face it I like nieman, he plays hard, but he is just not talanted enough to play at this level. When we had to have him he did OK, but the teams we have been playing latley with the quick guards he would have not helped us any. Fergerson is a big improvement form nieman. Not that I am taking shots at nieman, but fergerson is a better player. If we were up by 20 most of the game, then let the kid play all he wants, but we have to do what we have to do. So i am not going to bash sid for not playing nieman, and i will not rip nieman for his lack of skills. We may need him later on in the year, but right now he really can’t help us.

  22. Gene 01/03/2007 at 4:49 PM #

    Looking at some other school in the Pac-10, that team is now 6-7. They struggle shooting the ball and still hoist up too many 3’s. They shoot 3’s 40% of the time, and hit less than 33% of the threes. The games they have won – they shot fairly from 3. The games they have lost – they stunk from the 3 line. Sounds familiar. Long scoring droughts are common.

    http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/mensbasketball/pac10/2006-04-04-sendek-arizstate_x.htm

    Article on ASU hiring Sendek and goes into some detail about ASU’s basketball “tradition”.
    The highlights:
    Nothing about ASU basketball has ever been easy. Over the last 25 years, the Sun Devils have been in the NCAA Tournament only three times.

    In the Valley, ASU basketball has become a forgotten sliver of in a fractured market dominated by the Suns.

    Love talked about creating a home-court atmosphere that has been absent at Wells Fargo Arena. She also said there has been serious talk about the construction of a practice court.

    For years, the Sun Devils have complained about having to practice at nearby high schools when Wells Fargo was booked for other functions.

    ASU lost its top two scorers from a year ago. You can’t compare the basketball situation at ASU to NCSU and judge a coach by how he’s doing at ASU.

    Frank McGuire did not have nearly as much success at South Carolina, as he did with UNC and St. Johns. Dave Odom, who turned Wake Forest into a very good basketball program, isn’t having nearly the same kind of success in South Carolina. Norm Sloan didn’t have the same kind of success at Florida, in the 1980’s, as he did with NCSU in the 1970’s. Bill Foster couldn’t emulate the success he had at Duke, at the other schools he coached at.

    A lot of coaches have been successful at one program, but aren’t able to match that level of success at another program, becaue the situations are different between the two programs.

    Hard to say Herb’s awful because of he’s doing at ASU, when no one has been any good coaching ASU. Maybe he’ll turn ASU around or maybe’ll ASU will kill his coaching career, but there’s no reason to gloat over the problems he’s going to have in the desert.

    Herb doesn’t coach here anymore. No NCSU fan I knew cared two hoots about ASU before this season and I think we should go back to our apathy about ASU, since there is not real reason for us to be interested in that program.

  23. Woof Wolf 01/03/2007 at 5:07 PM #

    SG: I agree about what a win against BC might mean. I was looking at the schedule earlier. I think the next three games will help us adjust our expectations for the rest of the year. We’ve got BC and Clemson at home followed by a road game at Wake Forest. If we don’t win one of those games we will be lucky to win three or four games for the rest of the year. Win one of them and we have a good shot at winning five or six and making it to the NIT; win two and we can dream about seven or eight wins and maybe one in the tournament and the NCAA bubble.

    I won’t even think about winning all three and won’t be suprised if we lose all three. I never thought watching this team woukd be so much fun. You can just see the indivdual improvement with each game.

  24. redfred2 01/03/2007 at 5:22 PM #

    Ah, now Gene, my but the fortunes have turned so quickly. I wonder if we’d be hearing grumblings, and Herb’s name more often around here, if NCSU was stumbling and embarrassing themselves as so many NCSU fans predicted they would, right now. I’d have to believe so.

    What your post doesn’t take into account is that those coaches moved on to what would be considered basically lesser basketball programs and that none of those coaches were on the upstroke at the time they left those better programs. It also fails to point out that no matter how diminished it was been allowed to become recently, the name NC State (in Herb’s and Norm’s cases), along with all of those being ACC programs, does carry a bulk of the weight, and did have a built in factor that afforded every one of the coaches that you mentioned, the ability to recruit and build like they may not be able to do elsewhere.

    It was an opportunity that most of those coaches you mentioned above, used to it’s fullest and took advantage of, while making the best of their good fortune as head coaches in the ACC. On the other hand, there have those who have ignored it, and gone off on their own way.

  25. Gene 01/03/2007 at 5:31 PM #

    What your post doesn’t take into account is that those coaches moved on to what would be considered basically lesser basketball programs

    Well if I didn’t make the point clear enough, thanks for rephrasing it.

    I’m just tired of people constantly bringing up Herb, either to put him down or to put Sidney down.

    He’s no longer the coach. He’s not an alum, like Derreck Whittenburg (or Archie Miller if he ever becomes a head coach), where fans feel a certain loyalty to see how they’re doing after their playing careers end, so I don’t see a reason for people to keep bringing him up.

    The seasons half way over and some folks can’t get over Herb.

    For a guy, who lacked charisma, he sure does get a lot of people’s attention and has held it long after anyone should care…kind of ironic isn’t it…

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