SFN’s Take: TOB > PJ

SFN has been hearing from a variety of sources that Boston College head man Tom O’Brien has emerged as a serious contender for the NC State job. As you may know, O’Brien has taken some heat from the Eagle faithful for not being able to get BC over the proverbial hump. While we agree that O’Brien may have maxed out what he is able to accomplish in Beantown, we do not believe that his ceiling would necessarily be limited at NC State.

O’Brien is supposedly willing to make a move because Boston is a pro sports town, almost exclusively. BC also has a small alumni base, which has led to good Eagle teams getting subpar bowl bids. The argument is that better bowls would lead to more recruiting momentum, as would a thriving, college-town environment – and ultimately, a chance at more success at NC State.

Of course, you might note that you could say the same thing about Paul Johnson. There is some truth to that. However, we believe that Tom O’Brien has some clear advantages over PJ – (i) BCS conference experience; (ii) has recruited at least some premium athletes; (iii) less potential to be negatively recruited against successfully; and (iv) a stronger staff (with pretty remarkable continuity).

O’Brien is no spring chicken, but young enough (58) to have a good ten year run at NC State. Plus, we already know his likely “floor” – 7-9 win seasons, which would at least get NC State into good bowl games periodically. We also think that it is reasonable to hope for greater success (contention for ACC titles) with a fresh start and a different environment to work in. Is it guaranteed? No. But nobody is going to be a sure thing here. SFN thinks that O’Brien would be a very good choice.

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General NCS Football Tom O'Brien

336 Responses to SFN’s Take: TOB > PJ

  1. Mr O 12/06/2006 at 12:36 PM #

    I got those numbers also from Grantwolf at Packpride. He deserved the credit for putting them together as Clarksa also state above.

  2. tcthdi-tgsf-twhwtnc 12/06/2006 at 12:36 PM #

    Why not more talk of Mike Sherman? He seems to want the job and he has coached at the highest level as well as in college including time at Texas A&M and UCLA.

  3. partialqualifier 12/06/2006 at 12:38 PM #

    And can we please quit comparing people with Herb?

    I dont like him…never did. But this is not about him. To say that a guy who has won as much as Johnson and O’Brien is anything like Herb Sendek is utterly ridiculous!!

    As for posters….I challenge you to go to any message boards for any team and find a place where the fans are 100% happy with the coach. Posters are fans like us. We are committed and some of us are even pretty knowledgeable, but at the end of the day we love to piss and moan about everything!

  4. GrandWolf 12/06/2006 at 12:38 PM #

    From Mr. O; “How does Herb Sendek’s tenure at NC State even come close to TOB? The analogy makes very little sense”

    Well, like Herb, O’Brien has been there 10 years. Like Herb, O’Brien usually beats the cupcakes he should; like Herb, O’Brien has about split games with equal teams, like Herb, O’Brien’s teams usually lose to highly ranked teams, and just like Herb went one to two games deep in the NCAA’s, O’Brien has managed to go mid level, so-so bowls. Winning a few, losing a few. And like Herb, after 10 years O’Brien doesn’t have jacksquat of a title to show for it.

    I have NO DOUBT that TOB could come to NC State and eventually be winning 8 or 9 games a year. But his BCS level track record shows that is about all we can expect. Again, if O’Brien is hired I hope he proves me wrong.

  5. waxhaw 12/06/2006 at 12:38 PM #

    I’m not saying one or the other is more likely to achieve these results but which would most of you prefer:

    Scenario A: 10 years with records ranging from 7-4 to 9-2. Bowl bids most years (Peach, Gator, Car) but no division wins or appearances in the title game.

    Scenario B: 10 years with records ranging from 5-6 to 10-1. Bowl bids 3 out of every 4 years with one ACC title (and BCS bid), 2 ACC title games and bowl bids from all differnt types including Boise, etc.

  6. MatSci94 12/06/2006 at 12:39 PM #

    “If O’Brien is a serious candidate”

    This was a name mentioned by David Glen, so I would take it that he’s a serious candidate.

  7. Cardiff Giant 12/06/2006 at 12:39 PM #

    Given that Mike Leach is now pretty firmly linked – at least in the rumor mill – with Miami, it infuriates me all the more that we made no apparent effort to even talk to him.

  8. waxhaw 12/06/2006 at 12:40 PM #

    Personally, I’d go with Scenario B, because I’d accept a losing season every now and again for a championship type season every now and again.

  9. vtpackfan 12/06/2006 at 12:46 PM #

    I love the idea of either candidate. An ex-Marine and the current HC at Navy. We have harped for years that this team needed some discipline and self control to replace the “gangsta” hurd mentallity. Obviously some higher ups are thinking the same and have put these two to the top of the list. Thats a good thing.

  10. wolpfack 12/06/2006 at 12:47 PM #

    Pop quiz hotshot: what if PJ and TOB both dont pan out…if they are our A-list, who do we look to on the B-list: Jimbo is more than likely out after we (a) told him thanks, but no thanks w/ an interview and (b) informed him he is a b-lister…

  11. partialqualifier 12/06/2006 at 12:49 PM #

    I am trying to figure out what the hell is wrong with winning 8 games a year? There arent many teams in the country that win 8 or 9 a year every year. In 100 years NC State is 6 games over .500 in football, so 80-40 after 10 years would be unbelievably productive!!!!!

    Cardiff Giant: My sentiments exactly!!! That goeas back to what I have been complaining about all along. Other teams are out there scouring the country looking for the best possible coaches they can find, and all we want to do is give Paul Johnson the job without interviewing any-damn-body else!!!

  12. wolfpacker55 12/06/2006 at 12:51 PM #

    jbpackfan, what is your problem. If you are too ignorant to discuss anything but rumors then sit at home and be quiet. You have no facts to support your theory that jimbo is no longer a candidate. Shut up.

  13. partialqualifier 12/06/2006 at 12:51 PM #

    wolpfack…..great comment!!!

    You are 100% correct there! Personally tho….given the fact that in 27 years Johnson has managed no higher than Navy, I would be shocked if he turned down NC State.

  14. brown pelican 12/06/2006 at 12:52 PM #

    cardiff—couldn’t agree more on the leach opinion—he brings a perspective about balanced offense to the game that few others do—distribution regarding run/pass takes a back seat to making the defense defend all five skill players—their distribution to those five is more balance than most—good source to reference regarding their run/pass procuction is smartfootball by chris—also—his teams play pretty good defense—still—the matter at hand—o’brien would make the pack more consistent than chuck did—however—his upside is not quite what the untested (in big time D-1 football) johnson’s is—i like the tressel comparison noted on the thread earlier—let’s take a chance

  15. vtpackfan 12/06/2006 at 12:52 PM #

    wolpfack^ Lee Corso is one option, and the other would probably be buying out Rich Rodriquez.

  16. wolfpacker55 12/06/2006 at 12:53 PM #

    The mike sherman talk must stop, he ran the packers straight into the ground to the point where they may not be able to recover. And thats with a hall of famer at qb.

  17. MatSci94 12/06/2006 at 12:57 PM #

    “You have no facts to support your theory that jimbo is no longer a candidate.”

    http://www.850thebuzz.com/blog/?p=2093

    LSU’s Jimbo Fisher, who was contacted by Chuck Neinas, had hopes of tallking with Lee Fowler yesterday but had his meeting cancelled.

    http://html.wral.com/sh/blogger/2006/12/obrien-johnson-atop-ncsu-list.html

    Meanwhile, LSU offensive coordinator Jimbo Fisher is no longer under consideration by the Wolfpack. Sources said Fisher received word from NCSU on Tuesday that a planned interview would not take place.

    “Jimbo was on their B list,” a source close to Fisher said. “He was told that they feel good about getting something done with one of the people on their A list, so there was no need for an interview.”

  18. highonlowe 12/06/2006 at 12:57 PM #

    Its difficult to understand how a fanbase feels about the coach from the outside. So I went to read up on the BC blogger Bill Maloney (EagleInAtlanta), who also has a AOLFanBlog.
    http://www.aolsportsblog.com/bloggers/bill-maloney
    There are some very interesting things that stick out, especially in the ‘5 takeaways from the Miami Loss‘ post. This one hit the hardest:

    5. Tom O’Brien will never coach in a BCS game. I wrote this after the NC State game and keep hoping to eat my words. But now, I write it with more confidence. His emotionless style and conservative approach and BC’s increasingly easy schedule will always keep BC bowl-eligible, but the risk-averse coach will never make the strategic of emotional decisions needed to win a conference championship.

  19. packfanstk 12/06/2006 at 12:58 PM #

    TOB is not going anywhere. I also would very much like to see Mike Sherman get some serious consideration. If things don’t pan out with Paul Johnson, I say let’s go after Sherman.

  20. tcthdi-tgsf-twhwtnc 12/06/2006 at 1:02 PM #

    The mike sherman talk must stop, he ran the packers straight into the ground to the point where they may not be able to recover. And thats with a hall of famer at qb.

    Yes, by not putting Farve on the bench. Farve shouldn’t have been a started in the NFL for 4 or 5 years now. Much like Shula ran Miami into the ground by continuing to start an aging and ineffective Marino. It is hard to bench an icon QB in the NFL

  21. Wolfpack4ever 12/06/2006 at 1:02 PM #

    Cardiff Giant Says: “Given that Mike Leach is now pretty firmly linked – at least in the rumor mill – with Miami, it infuriates me all the more that we made no apparent effort to even talk to him.”

    Do you expect the efforts to be apparent? RAWFS is praising Uncle Jed for keeping the search under wraps, you’re infuriated all the more because it is not apparent what the committee is doing.

    Don’t you think it is better to quiet and not be apparent than to have coaches afraid to contact us for fear of being found out by their current employer. Of course the unemployed ones don’t have anything to lose. But for consistency I like it not apparent who is contacted and who is not.

  22. vtpackfan 12/06/2006 at 1:07 PM #

    Getting TOB might mean getting the full staff. The DC has been with him the longest, but might get the opportunity to be the HC for BC next. The low attrition ate at BC is incredible. Only VT has done it better I believe. Whether its great blocking up front (which PJ’s teams do), coaching turnover, or discipline it’s amazing how these two fit extremely well into a scheme of coming into Raleigh and turning it around in a hurry.

    Sure, I think it’s great and really professional if we “scour” the country for potential candidates. Interview everyone, let’s do it. Let’s get a coach who is really good at selling himself in the hiring process. A real good salesman is what we need around here. Who cares that PJ or TOB have succeeded in the areas that were thought by many to being the missing link between the our current state and let’s say Wakes, for instance.

  23. statered 12/06/2006 at 1:07 PM #

    highonlowe, that is precisely wht TOB scares me. This is entertainmnet after all.

  24. wolpfack 12/06/2006 at 1:09 PM #

    PQ – I want to agree with you, but after watching the mess of a basketball search, until a K is signed, sealed and delivered, my trust that Fowl-up can close a deal is at zero…

    As usual, with all the chatter going on both coaches are saying they plan on staying put…you never know, this could all end up being basketball search part duex…I hope note, but I have a strange feeling that its getting close to that point

  25. partialqualifier 12/06/2006 at 1:10 PM #

    highonlowe:

    How many BCS bowls has Johnson coached in? Zero. That doesnt neccessarily take him out of the running either.

    I am not a huge O’Brien fan…but if they beat Navy in the bowl game he would have won 68 games in 8 years…that is 8.5 wins per season. Dick Sheridan averaged 7.4 wins per season in a water-downed ACC of the 80’s. O’Brien’s winning percentage is .687 at BC, which is a helluva lot better than NC STates over the history of the school. This guy can coach. If he averages 8.5 wins a year at NCSU…who cares if he is bland?

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