Wake Forest 25, NC State 23

General NCS Football120

On a beautiful day for football in Raleigh, Wake Forest kicks 3 50 yarders to down the Wolfpack.

Couple Saturday afternoon thoughts for the blog:
-Great day for football. Noon games stink.
-Late arriving crowd, got into the game in the 2nd quarter.
-You would think a TD saving safety would be a good thing.
-Please kill the cartoon on the jumbotron before the game.
-Andre Brown is clearly better than Toney Baker, but Baker had a lot more touches in the second half.
-The second half play calling was a C+ at best. I would run Brown before Baker on first down
-One day we will “chip” a DE on a screen pass
-Jim Grobe is a great coach and hopefully he will get the hell out of Winston Salem
-Deraney didn’t have his “A” game today
-Mike Nugent Jr. had a great game
-John Bunting will be fired sometime soon
-If we lose to UNC it will be a death blow to Amato
-The 330PM game selection this saturday is awful.
-Officials missed a clear late hit on Andre Brown’s long run in the 4th quarter.

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General NCS Football

120 Responses to Wake Forest 25, NC State 23

  1. packpigskinfan23 10/16/2006 at 1:46 PM #

    ^thats how I saw it… of course its hard to tell exact yards when your on an endzone, and low… but it felt that way as well.

    Is that what happened with the Deraney miss?!?! wow… I felt like an idiot, cause right before he kicked it, I was telling my buddy how good he was… afterwards he looked at me like “yeah, RIGHT…”

  2. choppack1 10/16/2006 at 1:51 PM #

    “chop, that was a 10 yard out, not a ten yard curl that they almost had the int on. ”
    You’re exactly right. It’s been a long, long time….

    “Slants are tough against that zone also. ”

    Yep, we’re in agreement there – too.

    Basically – I thought we utilized our backs pretty good in the passing game. Like I said, my biggest beef Saturday wasn’t w/ the play-calling. I thought it gave us a chance to win. You make a good point on flooding the zone. Daniel was doing a good job of taking what was given to him – especially on that last drive. I was actually thinking TD, not FG w/ the way we were moving the ball. We had moved it 20 yards in 1:50 or so w/out getting out of bounds. I believe that was a second down play – and I feel we could have at least advanced it to the 30 w/ >15 seconds left. If he doesn’t get the concussion, I’d wager we’re celebrating a victory.

  3. Mike 10/16/2006 at 1:52 PM #

    Yeah, snap was not good but not awful either. Evans bobbled it and got it down late. Of course, kicker is always to blame and of course the idiot announcers had no clue.

  4. tcthdi-tgsf-twhwtnc 10/16/2006 at 1:56 PM #

    -Officials missed a clear late hit on Andre Brown’s long run in the 4th quarter.

    Thank you. This is the first mention I’ve seen of this and it was so obvious. They replayed it because Brown was hurt after the hit but no mention on TV. I don’t know if the radio guys called it.

  5. packpigskinfan23 10/16/2006 at 1:58 PM #

    choppack- I agree… no concussion, chances are we have a W. things were looking really good up till that point.

    oh well… so, next are the terps…

  6. Dan 10/16/2006 at 1:58 PM #

    Mike, I’m sorry. I have to quash the idea that Andre Brown was somehow shut down by WF. He wasnt.

    Lets list his 8 carries:

    1) On 1st and 10 – 1 rush for -1 yards
    2) On 2nd and 10 – ran for 13 yards
    3) On 1st and 10 – ran for 6 yards
    4) On 1st and Goal from the 1 – 1 yard carry for a TD (Note: that 1 yards carry IS NOT A STOP)
    5) On 1st and 10 – minus 21 yards on the fumble.
    6) On 1st and 10 – 5 yards
    7) On 1st and 10 – 2 yards
    8) On 2nd and 4 – 45 yards

    For the day Brown had the one big negative play. And WF only “stopped him” 2 other times. Once for negative yards and once for two yards. The other 5 carries went for at least 5 yards.

    That aint stopping anyone. The play calling stopped him. Note that he never got a 3rd down carry and only two 2nd down carries, both of which were hugely successful.

    Also note that we NEVER ran the ball on 3rd down. Not once. Basically, after 1st down, WFU KNEW we were throwing the ball. We only ran it 5 times in situations where it was 2nd and 4 or more. We only got stopped on those plays once. That was for 1 yard. We got three yards once. The other three times were for over 10 yards including the 45 yarder.

    I still really like Trestman, but we need to show some balance. We need to show that we are scared to run or pass in any situation. We were just too predictable on Saturday and made it easy on WF. So many time on 2nd and long WFU only had 6 in the box. Why not run on that?

  7. packpigskinfan23 10/16/2006 at 2:00 PM #

    it happened right in front of me… I was yelling for the flag before the whistle was even blown!!! so was my whole section. The announcers didnt even say ANYTHING?! thats horrible. I can understand with the officals. it looked close… but he was definatly out. they can miss stuff like that. but the announcers saw it more then a couple of times, and in slow motion I am sure.

  8. Dan 10/16/2006 at 2:28 PM #

    One more comment about the lack of balance in the play calling:

    Out of 29 first down plays. Only 12 were passes. 6 of those were screens to RBs. Meaning only 6 times on 1st down did we even attempt to “really” pass. What happened on the series’ where we changed it up? 1 time Dniel Evans was forced to run (eventual missed FG that series..botched catch by A Hill). 2 out of 5 times we were successfull with completions for firsts downs. 2 of the remaining 3 times we had imcompletions the 2nd down play was a successful rush for 10 yards or better.

    Out of 23 2nd down plays, we only attempted to run 6 times. When we did that, four times we ran for 1st downs. Only one time we failed to get a first down.

    What does that show? It shows that when you attemt to mix it up evenly on first and 2nd downs, you are usually successful. Trestman has to do a better job of making teams guess what is coming. I hope this week the run-pass distribution on 1st and 2nd down is closer to 50-50.

  9. tcthdi-tgsf-twhwtnc 10/16/2006 at 4:11 PM #

    Only thing on TV was that Brown was a little shook up on the play. The only thing I can think of is that the contact was initiated in bounds but it was unnecessary roughness because Brown was clearly out of bounds at the time he was yanked down by the collar.

    If Wake has a first down with the ball on the State 40 yard line with 3 minutes to play and State has one timeout does Wake even have to run a play with the new rules? Seems that the clock starts after ball is marked ready for play after a penalty. Couldn’t Wake just take delay of game penalties until the clock runs out? WF would have to take a knee once because of the NC State timeout but if you have enough yards to give why run a play?

  10. GAWolf 10/16/2006 at 4:20 PM #

    I’ve quit counting screens and shallow outs as passes. Just as many times as Blackmon breaks one for a ten yard gain, we have one batted down at the line, or worse yet thrown behind the receiver thus risking a fumble if it’s a backwards pass.

    I wish they would take them out of the playbook altogether. If we either run the ball or pass the ball each down, and I honestly believe we’d see much better production out of our offense.

    I’m still upset about how slow our running plays develop. With our offensive line being average at best, we should be smashing the ball up into the line to hit whatever holes they can produce and hold for however short they can hold them. It seems like it takes a lifetime for our backs to take the handoff.

  11. GAWolf 10/16/2006 at 4:21 PM #

    Didn’t Hill drop two huge passes?

  12. packpigskinfan23 10/16/2006 at 4:41 PM #

    Dan you said:

    “6 of those were screens to RBs.”

    to ME that is a run play. its a play that has a RB with the ball ON or BEHIND the LOS… I know offensive coord’s/media people dont see it as a run play, but the way we use it… it definatly not a passing play.

    “Out of 23 2nd down plays, we only attempted to run 6 times. When we did that, four times we ran for 1st downs. Only one time we failed to get a first down. ”

    somethings wrong with your math or my understanding there… how can 6 out of 23 times… with 4 times being for 1st downs, end up with us failing only once to get a 1st down? what happened to that other time? I’m not taking a shot at you… I’m just wondering if I am not understanding you correctly.

  13. Dan 10/16/2006 at 4:53 PM #

    “6 of those were screens to RBs.� to ME that is a run play

    Exactly my point.

    Well, I wasnt counting the time Evans dropped the snap on JD’s missed FG. I wrote it in the post, but it is a little confusing. Still, on the series just before the missed FG, AnT Hill dropped an easy first down. The defense was beaten there. Ant just let them off the hook.

    The point of the post was that we were very successful when we attempted to mix it up. The answer isnt “throw it more”, but both throw AND run it more. The run was there on 2nd down all day long. As the numbers show.

    All I know is if we 1st down-run, 2nd down-pass, 3rd down-pass next week then we will be doing a lot of 4th down-punt against Maryland. We have to keep them guessing.

  14. packpigskinfan23 10/16/2006 at 4:55 PM #

    I agree with the “keep them guessing” tactic… and I am not saying throw MORE… just THROW for some yards!!!

  15. Wolfpack4ever 10/16/2006 at 7:18 PM #

    GAWolf Says: “I’m still upset about how slow our running plays develop.”

    Our running plays are slow to develop because of the trap and cross blocking. It’s that kind of blocking that is producing 8 to 16 yard running plays between the tackles. With an average O-line, where we tried to muscle our way up the middle, we would be gaining 3 and 3 yard and having a lot more 3 and outs.

    We have to run outside occasionally to keep their D honest.

  16. Wolfpack4ever 10/16/2006 at 7:33 PM #

    tcthdi-tgsf-twhwtnc Says: “Officials missed a clear late hit on Andre Brown’s long run in the 4th quarter.”

    I saw the replay and it appeared to me that the hit wasn’t late, the defender had AB by the shoulder pads at the back of the neck when AB went out of bounds. He never turned loose and when ABs feet went out from under him, he was slammed onto his back. What could have been called was unnecessary roughness but that is hardly ever called when the original contact was made in the field of play.

  17. Wolfpack4ever 10/16/2006 at 7:43 PM #

    Dan Says: “Mike, I’m sorry. I have to quash the idea that Andre Brown was somehow shut down by WF. He wasnt.

    Lets list his 8 carries:

    1) On 1st and 10 – 1 rush for -1 yards
    2) On 2nd and 10 – ran for 13 yards
    etc. ”

    Great job of breaking down that aspect of the game — which is what the coaches do on Sunday.

    I occurred to me as I was reading your analysis, Trestman is likely used to this kind of feedback from the booth on Sunday and I’m wondering if he is getting this kind of support during the game.

    Another way of looking at this is AB’s running is about like passing — some are incomplete, some pick up good yardage and some go for big gains.

    Thanks, Dan, for the facts of the matter.

  18. packpigskinfan23 10/16/2006 at 8:14 PM #

    to me, it seems that some of our problems with getting plays off faster, are with the snaps…
    we are constantly having low snaps.

  19. Woof Wolf 10/16/2006 at 9:18 PM #

    There have been a lot of low snaps, but so far Daniel is handling them, They could affect the timing on a running play, but I haven’t seen that happen but once.

    Squatting down and concentrating on snapping that ball accurately through your legs knowing that as soon as your hand starts to move some 300 lb gorilla is going to knock the crap out of you is the gutsiest job on the field.

    The last thing I would want to do is try to make a correction and the balls start zinging over the QB’s head.

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  1. StateFans Nation » Blog Archive » Saturday Football Bytes - 11/17/2007

    wsxgXw Really enjoyed this article post. Keep writing.

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