Elevated (noah) Comments

'06 Football General125

You will have to forgive us for taking a day off after Saturday’s debacle. We just needed a break.

To start off this Monday we are going to elevate some comments from Saturday’s blog entry that we thought were really good and deserved special attention.

noah always delivers with accurate and astute insight. On Saturday he did a super job ofkeeping his head and trying to paint (what I think) are pretty accurate pictures of things for frustrated fans. He attributed his demeanor/perspective to the following:

I think the difference between my reaction and the reaction of others is that I expected us to be a pretty terrible team this year. Apparently,there were a lot of people thinking we’d nine games.

We’re a bad team. It happens. FSU damn near lost to Troy last night. Maryland and UVA are supposed to be led by brilliant coaches and they apparently suck this year too.

If you think changing coaches is going to fix this shit…you’re in for a rude awakening.

So, today we are going to elevate some of noah’s comments from Saturday’s thread to this entry so that it can serve as somewhat of a ‘guest column’.

I hope that we can encourage noah to keep visiting and sharing his thoughts. They are much appreciated:

My prediction is that we’ll win about three games this year. I think my pre-season prediction was four wins.

My post-season prediction is that we fire Chuck Amato, make all kinds of noise about hiring a top-notch, national-champion coach….end up hiring some poor, ill-prepared slob who wins about three games over the next five years and then 99 percent of the WPC stands around thinking, “Wha happened??� and saying, “I never wanted to fire Amato!�

The problem isn’t coaching. The problem is that we’ve gone about 3-for-80 in recruiting quality offensive linemen. To date, we’ve landed quality OL in Leroy Harris, Curtis Crouch aaaaand….uhh…well, I’m sure one of the guys we signed in the last two years will probably be halfway decent.

But we’ve whiffed on everyone else. We’ve been getting commitments from players who ought to be lining up for ECU and Marshall and W. Kentucky State and have no business trying to block for ACC backs.

Problem #2 — we signed two top 20 recruits at quarterback to replace Philip Rivers…it just happened that they were both horribly overrated. I watched Dook and Wake today — neither Stone or Davis would start for those two teams (whoever thought we’d trail both Dook and Wake at the quarterback position??).

It’s going to take a couple of years. I hope we give Amato the time to do it.

I have no doubt that we won’t…

In response to a question, “how are we not better than Akron” noah stated:

Because:

(1) The history of NC State is a pretty sorry one;
(2) The line between being pretty good and being pretty bad is a thin one;
(3) The failures that we’ve had in recruiting have been total losses and they’ve been at absolutely critical spots; and,
(4) Because even the best programs have bad years…Penn State, Tennessee, Notre Dame….

Sometimes the answer is to fire the coach…sometimes it’s not.

I’d just caution everyone that wants a new coach to recall the difficulty we had in hiring a coach for our basketball program…a program with two national titles and 10 league titles in the greatest basketball conference ever.

In football, we’ve won 10 games or more a grand total of ONE time. We would have just fired the guy who got us that double-digit win total. We have not won a league title since 1979.

In further response to “no NC State coach should lose to Akron”:

Dick Sheridan lost to ETSU at home. Should we have fired him? He also lost to awful Louisville and Va. Tech teams in years when he had great teams.

MOC lost to Baylor (the week after we beat #1 FSU)….and Baylor didn’t win another game all year.

Monte Kiffin only beat Richmond by six one year and got smacked around by Dook more than once.

Tom Reed lost to Furman.

Bo Rein lost to Furman and ECU when they were in the Southern Conference.

Earle Edwards lost to Richmond in 1970.

Al Michaels lost to Kent State.

Unless your name is Lou Holtz, you have plenty of bad losses on your resume if you’ve ever coached at NC State.

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'06 Football General

125 Responses to Elevated (noah) Comments

  1. GAWolf 09/11/2006 at 11:14 PM #

    On a sidenote…. how damn good is LT?

  2. Wolfpack4ever 09/11/2006 at 11:47 PM #

    packpigskinfan23 Says:

    what is it that you guys have seen in Burke and Evans that makes you think they can do more then Stone?

    packpigskinfan23, they are clueless. don’t you read what they say. Their knowledge of football consists of “trying shit.”

  3. Wolfpack4ever 09/11/2006 at 11:57 PM #

    packpigskinfan23 Says:

    Wolfpack4ever~ your just on a nice little angst ridden rampage on everyone now arent you… why dont you just pick apart EVERYONE on the boards comments.

    People present ideas. I read them and comment. What’s the problem? Do I need to mindlessly chant “bench Stone, Fire Chuck” to post here? I admit picking most of this crap apart is a bit like shooting fish in a barrell but, hey, sports is sports. 😉

  4. bTHEredterror 09/12/2006 at 2:52 AM #

    Our program under Chuck has been better than under anyone but Holtz, but I feel the current situation is a no-win. Chuck has brought us where we are, wherever that is, and although there are far too many heartaches, there have been some highs. And the same could be said of MOC, DS, or insert State coach here. This is our program, and to change it I think we have to do something different. Like stick with one we’re with. This isn’t the pros and things sometimes work differently. Barry Alvarez took forever in Wisconsin, but he got it done. You can certainly counter, with a comparison to Spurrier at Dook, that a quick fix is possible. I concede a quick fix can happen, but when Spurrier left, the program left with him.

    Nothing good is ever easy, and unless Cowher has had secret discussions with Fowl-up, Chuck will be our coach at least one more year. Lee just went thru a ROUGH Basketball hire, and what about his past actions has indicated the nerve to want to shake up the other big money maker less than a year later? The reasons he will stay will be the wrong ones, but it will turn out to be a blessing.

    Don’t misunderstand me, I do blame Chuck for alot of the problems we see. I think he is a poor game planner based, on the number of times lesser teams have beaten us with solid strategy despite what appear to be talent deficiencies. We also lose the first half more often than not, and have to make up ground every game. Our guys have lapses in key situations, and play almost purely on emotion. Execution always beats emotion, because the momentum changes so much. Uncontrolled emotion prompts guys to run to celebrate with the “O” when you are on extra point team, and getting flagged to set up the backbreaker drive. But to his credit, somehow they adjust at half time and get back into most games.

    Only to be undone by….. penalties…..turnovers…..missed 3rd down conversions……referees?.

    This loss was a smack in the face. For Chuck, for the players, and for us as fans. Funny how things change in a week, from lightweight schedule and looking forward to conference play, to Southern Miss Saturday is vital to our season and our program. Just like last year, only earlier on. Maybe this can be a blessing in disguise. We’ve thought since we upset ND in the Gator, we were better than we were. It took Akron to wake us up. The devil is in the details, and details (penalties, TO’s) beat us every time. I believe the HC should be held accountable, but to do so, Fowler is indicting his own Atheletic Department and employment decisions, which would mean he’s next on the block. As foolish as he seems, bet he has thought of that and will stay loyal to Chuck until ____ replaces him and fires CA. Or until Sid hangs an ACC championship banner or better.

    Chuck is a fighter, and that has contributed to his troubles by contentious encounters with the same media who relish in their “hot seat” psychobabble now. I’m taking ’em one game at a time, because as bad as the game turned out, good things happened in the second half, that I hope they will all build off. They’re a young team so you never know what you’re gonna get, but don’t write off any season after week two. It’s a good point our future opponents struggled Saturday, except BC vs Clem. They can maybe squeeze five games out this year amongst USM, MD, VA, Wake and their Young QB, and then have Chuck’s head on the chopping block for the in-state double kick to the ribs, or not and get a second tier bowl. {GT, Clem, FSU, BC} = loss.

  5. wayofthemaster 09/12/2006 at 6:07 AM #

    Good post, bTHEredterror.

    I have a question for everyone.

    Who would you rather have coaching your college football team?

    Coach A

    For whatever reason (facilities, location, tradition) is unable to recruit on the same level with the top teams in his conference.

    Yet his team finishes in the top half of the conference nearly every season.

    The team overachieves due to discipline (lack of penalties & turnovers), precise technique, and near flawless execution.

    Kirk Ferentz of Iowa seems to be one of these “type” of coaches.

    Coach B

    Has a reputation as one of the top recruiters (and motivators) in his conference… if not the nation.

    Team finishes in the top half of the conference nearly every season.

    The team underachieves (lack of discipline – penalties & turnovers) or at least it seems to, since it is loaded with top-notch elite talent.

    Bobby Bowden seems to be one of these “type” of coaches.

    It seems that Amato is more of a Coach B “type,” – understandable since he learned from Bowden.

    There is only one MAJOR problem with this “type” of coach.

    If you are going to be this “type” of coach you have to recruit top-notch elite talent. We’re talking USC, Texas, Notre Dame, Florida St., Miami,
    Florida, Ohio St., talent.

    Outside of Defensive Line, Amato has failed to recruit at this level (few can!). And recruiting even seems to be taking a dip the last few years
    and perhaps this upcoming off-season as well.

    Can this “type” of coach even succeed with the Wolfpack?

    Can this level of talent be recruited to North Carolina State University – a school with little to no football tradition to speak of?

  6. Cardiff Giant 09/12/2006 at 9:01 AM #

    “Would you prefer public bad-mouthing his team and players?”

    Nice false dilemma, this.

    “Crediting Amato’s ego is an anti-Amato self-serving interpretation..”

    Crediting Amato’s ego is a simple statement of fact. Amato’s ego could fit snugly inside of St. Peter’s Basilica, but few other places. I don’t need to be anti-Amato (I am not, really) to note his big ego. I merely need eyes and ears that function with a modicum of efficiency.

    “I like that he sets the bar high.”

    Yet he refuses to acknowledge that he has failed to meet his own expectations.

  7. Rick 09/12/2006 at 9:08 AM #

    Until Fower is gone it makes no sense to get rid of anyone.

  8. packpigskinfan23 09/12/2006 at 9:38 AM #

    well 4Ever if you reallypayed attention to all my posts you would know that I am not for benching Stone or firing Amato. I do think that you “presenting ideas” is turning into you thinking your smarter then everyone here… asking people “what their smoking” and telling people they are “clueless to the game of football” makes you look like an ass. I gave a very good description of what I would like to see change with our team and I get asked something as useless as to what I am smoking? comments like this are just as ignorant as those who just point fingers at Amato and Stone.

  9. Wulfpack 09/12/2006 at 10:31 AM #

    http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/sports/colleges/15496845.htm

    Oh my. Scheduling teams like Akron does nothing to help this struggling program. It’s a no win situation.

  10. redfred2 09/12/2006 at 11:17 AM #

    ^Wulf

    Now that wasn’t one of Chuck’s brighter statements at all. Actually it was an excuse and unwillingness to admit that his team got out played, he got out coached, and the Zips came out with the win.

    Being stubborn and unwilling to admit that your team wasn’t quite up to the task are traits that we have had to suffer around here long enough. It is time someone’s almighty AD to step in and put a sock in it.

  11. tcthdi-tgsf-twhwtnc 09/12/2006 at 12:10 PM #

    Only if you have Cowher lined up do you fire Chuck. You hold one presser, to announce that Chuck has decided to pursue other opportunities and we are please to introduce our new coach Bill Cowher.

    No need to let CA just for the sake of getting another coach. Amato is no Arizona State bball coach. He shows passion and he get pissed when he doesn’t win, he cares about the program unlike the great satan in Arizona.

  12. graywolf 09/12/2006 at 2:09 PM #

    The great domino will be the Carolina game. If this team loses for the third consecutive time to our rivals in Chapel Hill then I see the domino effect occur and someone else is coaching in Raleigh next year.
    I dream that Cowher is open for a new challenge.
    Go Pack.

  13. Wulfpack 09/12/2006 at 2:13 PM #

    And he speaks to the press like he’s been drinking since sunrise yesterday. It’s all about the results for me, and lately his results have been rather putrid. This program is spiraling helplessly out of control, and nobody’s in shop to fix it. Chuck’s old troopers saw this mess from a mile away and got out before it was time to look for a new job.

  14. redfred2 09/12/2006 at 9:28 PM #

    Fortunately for Duke and Carolina, the administration at NCSU did not require wins against their programs in order for us to keep their most favorite, non threatening, and unopposing basketball coach on board for a decade. I’m just wondering if giving one game away in football this season, just to insure a similar future with regards to our football coach now, isn’t in the back of someone’s mind about now. Kind of a, let’s carry him for a while thing until there is absolutely no way any future threat can develop in Raleigh. Kinda like when they were always talking so highly about our basketball coach which convinced some that he was just what a school like little harmless nc state needed. Talking down, but unnoticeably to some.

    Nah, no one would do that, not the powder blues anyway, they have own constipated coach to deal with. But the strategy could possibly be successful for someone else’s future anyway.

  15. Wolfpack4ever 09/12/2006 at 9:44 PM #

    packpigskinfan23 Says:

    September 12th, 2006 at 9:38 am
    well 4Ever if you reallypayed attention to all my posts you would know that I am not for benching Stone or firing Amato. I do think that you “presenting ideasâ€? is turning into you thinking your smarter then everyone here… asking people “what their smokingâ€? and telling people they are “clueless to the game of footballâ€? makes you look like an ass. I gave a very good description of what I would like to see change with our team and I get asked something as useless as to what I am smoking? comments like this are just as ignorant as those who just point fingers at Amato and Stone.”

    Shit! I can’t argue with anything you say here. What the hell was I smoking? And I surely didn’t need to say some were clueless to football, did I?

    I guess I got into that jiving mode some of my friends and I get into when we are talking on subjects we really don’t know squat about. 😉

  16. Wolfpack4ever 09/12/2006 at 10:00 PM #

    packpigskinfan23 Says:

    “well 4Ever if you really payed attention to all my posts you would know that I am not for benching Stone or firing Amato.”

    But I do pay attention to your posts. I can see how it happened but ‘s a misunderstanding. I was quoting you and agreeing. BTW people upset with me and on my ass is a good thing if it will get them of Chuck and Marcus. It’s not that Chuck has coached well or Marcus has played well, but that they are coaching and playing Saturday for NCSU. I believe negativity breds negativeness and if some can get upset with me or direct their ire toward me, then that’s a good thing.

    packpigskinfan23, I will admit I lost it with Mickey M. “loud-talking” about our offensive line, calling them fatass and not getting into a 3-point stance on a running play.

  17. Micky McCarthy 09/12/2006 at 10:52 PM #

    It riles me to know end when people make statements to the effect that no one is beating the door down for this job, the implication being that the ONLY solution is for us to get a proven, name coach. I’d take the guy at Akron at this point.

    Amato, at 60, is no spring chicken. IMO, he either wins 7-8 this year and next and stays for 3 more years to ride into the sunset at 65, or he steps down this year if not next.

    The benchmark for me is 6 wins this year. If he doesn’t get there, hell, get the guy from Akron.

    Unfortunately, I have no confidence in the present powers that be to identify and land a diamond in the rough.

    While I’m on that point, I believe we are at an inherent institutional disadvantage given that our two profile, revenue sports play at off campus arenas. We are unlike 99% of other NCAA schools where 6 or 7 given weekends each year 50,000+ alumni return to wander the campus and wax nostalgia over the ‘ole alma mater.

    We need to model our Athletics program after the successful formula existing at Louisville today, a university similar to ours in many of the respects I outlined above. I say shitcan Fowler yesterday, and go get the #2 in the Cardinals Athletic Department to take command of this ship.

  18. redfred2 09/12/2006 at 11:58 PM #

    I probably don’t need to say it, but please disregard my last post. That’s not me.

    Terrible day for CA, but I’m still behind him.

  19. class of 74 09/13/2006 at 6:39 AM #

    ^^I say get Bobby Petrino and the UL AD. We need help at both positions!

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