Worst Loss of the Sendek Era?

General Headscratchers NCS Basketball161

I think so. It was disgusting to watch this overachieving Carolina team come in and outwork us like that. They wanted each loose ball, each rebound 1000 times worse than we did. To his credit, Sendek didn’t try putting any lipstick on the pig, admitting that we were outcoached, outplayed, out-everything. And that pretty much sums it up. It was humiliating, and it will take more than a 12-win ACC season to make up for it. And I really don’t want to see the “0 for Roy” streak extended in the ACC semis.

What will make up for it? An Elite Eight or an ACCT title. Anything less, and this season will leave a very bitter taste in my mouth.

More thoughts in the morning. I need some freaking sleep.

TWO LAST THOUGHTS: The game got so out of hand that Quinton Thomas got significant minutes. Quinton f’ing Thomas! And they extended the lead with him in the game. Also, my last fuse was lit when we refused to speed up the offense or press on defense down 18 points with 5 minutes to play. But when Roy sent in the blue team in the last minute, we pressed ’em with our regulars! Way to show some real stones there, Coach!

About BJD95

1995 NC State graduate, sufferer of Les and MOC during my entire student tenure. An equal-opportunity objective critic and analyst of Wolfpack sports.

General Headscratchers NCS Basketball

161 Responses to Worst Loss of the Sendek Era?

  1. JohnPack 02/23/2006 at 1:43 PM #

    They care because there is EXISTING tradition. There are records to play for, there are more banners to hang, there is the pride of playing for the team you grew up loving. See my previous post about kids growing up with favorites and how it changes recruiting.

    Sam ’92,

    Did Les Robinson put us on probation? Did Herb? No. It was V. He did great things but he also set the program back years with all the violations. Gotta take the bad with the good.

    Scott, I agree. It would be awesome if somehow we had found a way, with all we have against us, to build a powerhouse in the last ten years. We havent. We have however built a consistent program that, at least for now, appears to be growing stronger. Who would have though the pack would be better this season after losing the ACC player of the year?

  2. JohnPack 02/23/2006 at 1:48 PM #

    Scott, wake up man. When Herb took over we WERE a third class program. I very VIVIDLY remember the Les Robinson invitational games. I remember losing to Campbell in Reynolds. I remember winning two games in conference year after year. This was all while Duke was winning three national championships and UNC was winning another. What do you expect the kids to remember now? They are only 18 years old. They cant even remember back to Fire and Ice much less any of the success before that.

    At that time we had no hope, no real thought about winning games against those teams. Now we can at least hope and actually have a shot. The next step is actually winning the games. If that doesnt ever come, then we can complain.

  3. class of '74 02/23/2006 at 1:55 PM #

    JohnPack. You are in dire need of a factual history lesson concerning the Valvano era and the Monteith legacy! I will not bother but just ask around and it will help you understand what I refer to as the Bolshevik overthrow of our athletics.

  4. Jim 02/23/2006 at 1:58 PM #

    I thought Brackman played the hardest/best. He’s not from this state. Neither was Corch. Neither was Monroe. (for two off the top of my head in 5 seconds.) What a load of crap that whole line of reasoning is.

    And if those types of selfish thoughts are actually prevelent throughout the team then IMO Herb has lost the team mentally.

  5. BJD95 02/23/2006 at 2:00 PM #

    V’s probation was relatively minor. It was the way NC State handled it that decimated the program.

    Sendek has indeed dug us out of Les’ hole. Kudos to him. But he’s been here a LONG time, and it’s time to take the next step as a program.

  6. UNC FAN 02/23/2006 at 2:08 PM #

    I really feel bad for you guys–this is your best year in recent memory (or if you are a state student right now…ever) and you cannot even beat us on our rebuilding year. [Edit: The rest is over the line and/or irrelevant. Some trash talk you guys are entitled to, but there’s a limit.]

  7. WTNY 02/23/2006 at 2:14 PM #

    Please remove the trash ^ so we can continue the discussion.

  8. class of '74 02/23/2006 at 2:15 PM #

    IMHO kids today play for what kids played for in the 50’s, 60’s, 70’s and 80’s.
    They all played first for pride and a very few have realistic dreams of a pro career.

  9. Sam '92 02/23/2006 at 2:16 PM #

    JohnPack, Jimmy V, god rest his soul, was *fifteen years ago*. herb has had *ten years* running the program

    our program does not suffer any longer from Jimmy V’s probation — it suffers from Herb Sendek

    Herb’s mediocrity has nothing to do with Jimmy V’s legacy and everything to do with Herb.

    Herb simply cannot, and never will, bring the best out of his players in big games, in close games. he doesn’t have the right personality for it.

    credit where credit is due — Herb runs a clean program that will get into the NCAA tournament with some consistency

    but will we, as students, alums, fans, get excited before every big game, because we know that our guys have it in them to pull off a win over anybody? ask yourself, ask around, who feels that way about our program?

    it’s not there . . . because Herb can’t deliver it

  10. JohnPack 02/23/2006 at 2:26 PM #

    If you are so sure Herb cant deliver, please stop watching. Please stop complaining, and by all means dont follow the pack into the ncaa tournament…again.

    I just cant get through. Herb is NOT a great coach. Doubt he will ever be. He is better than 8-9 of the other coaches in the coference though.

    I just cant believe that some fans still live in the past and cant enjoy any current success because of it. If you want to do something about it, donate money to the program, volunteer at camps, do SOMETHING to make a difference. The only difference you are making right now is to help bring the program down further.

    Good lord, what would everyone say if we actually won the championship? I guess then we wouldnt be good enough because Duke and UNC have won more in the last 10 years? Would we then fire Herb if he didnt do it again in the next five years? Lol…. Something tells me most of you guys dont have the same expectations on your own personal lives and careers that you do for your favorite team.

    Asking Herb Sendek to take a program from Les to a championship in under 10 years is like asking one of you to get a job coaching the Lakers.

  11. BJD95 02/23/2006 at 2:33 PM #

    ^ You’re basically admitting Sendek is “stuck on pretty good”, to use the phrase VaWolf and I like. The difference in opinion is that we are not willing to settle for that or be eternally grateful to be out of the Les Robinson hole.

  12. SaccoV 02/23/2006 at 2:41 PM #

    Corchiani, Gugliotta, Burleson, McMillan, etc. Even Whittenburg and Lowe have given back to the NC State community by being around it or by being great elsewhere. If these guys can’t handle the shadow cast by these players, they should have played for Drexel or American International. I agree with Trout wholeheartedly. If you want the fans and the media to stop overglorifying the past, give them something in the present!!

  13. class of '74 02/23/2006 at 2:44 PM #

    ^^
    Loyalty is an admirable trait but the loyalty I have is to the school and program not the individual. NCSU has my loyalty Herb must earn it and last night he did himself a disservice.

  14. class of '74 02/23/2006 at 2:51 PM #

    I wonder how Case got all of those Hoosiers juiced to come to NCSU and beat the Tarholes. He must of Jeddi mind tricked everyone of them. Boy was he ahead of his time!

  15. JohnPack 02/23/2006 at 2:55 PM #

    Sigh…

    So you think recruiting hasnt changed any in the last 50 years huh?

  16. JohnPack 02/23/2006 at 2:58 PM #

    I guess in a way I am agreeing with you guys…we are stuck in a pattern.

    I just disagree on the word chosen to describe that pattern. I dont think “mediocre” is a good word to use. State is a good team, bordering on being very good. You dont reside in the top 25 every year without being very good.

    Mediocre would describe UNC-Charlotte or some other team that cant consistently make the NCAA or keep a top 25 ranking.

  17. Don Oates 02/23/2006 at 3:02 PM #

    Hey UNC FAN – as a UNC grad myself I certainly understand the desire to gloat (and believe me I’ve got some State grads in my immediate family that have heard it today!), but do it on your own turf. I read/post to this blog sometimes because it is often filled with very interesting info and chatter, but there is no point acting a fool. It only makes us Tar Heels look bad, so let the team do our talking for us.

    Actually, I grew up in the 80’s watching the rivalry with the Pack at some of its best. I know it has to be frustrating to lose to your arch-rival (see UNC’s recent woes against the Dookies), but I think that a lot of you guys might be putting a bit too much emphasis on one game. State is a pretty good team, and I feel like they have a legitimate shot at postseason success. Heck, if State can beat BC and UNC loses another game (again see Dook on March 4), State should still finish 2nd. That ain’t bad!

    Now, if last night’s effort is indicative of the rest of the season for the Pack, then heads will roll…..

  18. Chapel Hill Fan's Take 02/23/2006 at 3:12 PM #

    I’ll be the first to admit I really do admire State fans. Why?

    1) They are loyal — they support their team through the thick and thin. They would not sale me a ticket. They would rather the seat be empty and their wallet a little lighter than have one more “tarhole” in the building.
    2) They actually know what they’re talking about — unlike many of my fellow heels fans…if someone says they are a state fan…they’re a state fan. They can talk in depth about current or past state teams. They never just happen to see the next day in the paper that their team played the night before.
    3) They have passion — albeit the students can take it way too far sometimes (throwing trash, flicking fingers, obscene comments, ect.) However, when the Heel’s come to town to play they always turn out in droves and get very loud to support the pack. They come early…leave late.

    I have grown accustomed to lackluster enthusiasm in Chapel Hill. People come late…leave early…no matter what the event. Football? Do many of our students know we have a team? I think not.

    Although I have grown to respect state fans as probably the best fans in the conference, I have never understood the Herb Sendeck Haters. Anyone who is even considering making the comment, “Herb must go� needs to drive over here to Chapel Hill and wear powder blue with me. STATE IS SECOND IN THE CONFERNCE and already has over 20 wins before March. Is Herb great? No. He will never have a program that is consistently better than Roy or K…but that’s reality. Appreciate everything this guy has done for you. He is a good coach and an even better guy. Don’t become lame Wolfpack Nation. Do not throw your loyalty for your coach around game by game.

  19. BJD95 02/23/2006 at 3:14 PM #

    ^ and ^^ Unfortunately, it’s not ONE game – it’s SIX. One more and Sendek will have entered MOC territory, and Lord help him, he doesn’t want to go there…

    Also, very few people are saying he needs to be fired – just grumbling about Sendek’s ability to get over the top. And I don’t think anyone would be sad to take a gamble on a new guy, who might get us out of being “stuck on pretty good.”

  20. Rick 02/23/2006 at 3:21 PM #

    I am willing to take a chance at being worse to have a chance at being better.
    Pretty good is the worst thing to me.

  21. Chapel Hill Fan's Take 02/23/2006 at 3:24 PM #

    Prove me wrong…but I think the reality is that State will have a very difficult time joining the ranks of a Duke or a Carolina in basketball.

  22. Trout 02/23/2006 at 3:25 PM #

    I dont think it is MOC territory quite yet. For one, at least Herb beat the really bad UNC teams. MOC didnt do that. Two, MOC’s 7, because of the structure of football, meant 7 years. Herb is at 3 years and counting. Three, Herb didnt hug Roy after any of the games. 🙂

    It wont happen, but what BJD95 just described probably sums it up: gamble on a new guy taking it beyond “pretty good”

  23. Trout 02/23/2006 at 3:27 PM #

    I can think of a lot of things worse than being “pretty good.” However, I do understand your view point.

  24. Trout 02/23/2006 at 3:29 PM #

    “Prove me wrong…but I think the reality is that State will have a very difficult time joining the ranks of a Duke or a Carolina in basketball.”

    Outside of the 50s, and 2-3 years in the 70s, we have not been on the same level of UNC. I dont think anyone at NC State is asking for that. The request is to win enough to “keep it interesting” and have occassional years of greatness (ACC title, Final 8/4, etc).

  25. Chapel Hill Fan's Take 02/23/2006 at 3:35 PM #

    Fair enough Trout…I can respect that.

    I want to get State Fan’s perspective on this issue:

    It seems to me that all the state fans I know act as if State is a football school since Chuck came several years ago. Aside from the one Gator Bowl year the basketball team has been consistently better than the football team. Why is there this huge disconnect?

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