If I Owned Basketball LTRs…

General NCS Basketball31

Here’s a beauty that was in my home e-mail inbox:

Dear Wolfpack Fan,

THANKSGIVING SPECIAL
Lower Level Tickets – $10 each
Upper Level Tickets – $5 each

NC State Basketball vs. VMI
Wednesday night at 7:30pm
RBC Center

Things Wolfpack Basketball Fans Should Be Thankful For:

1. A 3-0 start to the season

2. A very deep Wolfpack bench – All 13 Wolfpack players scored this past weekend.

3. The Wolfpack Thanksgiving Special – Do you have family and friends coming into town for Thanksgiving and need to get them out of the house.

Take advantage of this great offer to see the undefeated Wolfpack face VMI on Wednesday night.

To take advantage of this offer tickets must be purchased in advance (by 4:30pm on Wednesday) by calling the NC State Ticket Office at (919) 865-1510 or in person at 5400 Trinity Road in Raleigh. Please mention the Thanksgiving Special when ordering.

Tickets going for $5/10. Were they assessed at this price for the season tickets LTR holders had to buy? There’s no doubt that this does represent the market, however (unlike the $32 we tried to extract from folks for the MTSU football game). Either way, it’s going to piss off a portion of the fanbase, but that’s the position you put sports marketing in with such a weak scheduling philiosophy…

About BJD95

1995 NC State graduate, sufferer of Les and MOC during my entire student tenure. An equal-opportunity objective critic and analyst of Wolfpack sports.

General NCS Basketball

31 Responses to If I Owned Basketball LTRs…

  1. Jeff 11/21/2005 at 2:22 PM #

    So, we charge the people that pay the most for the rights to own tickets $27 a ticket for this game….and then we admit that the market for the tickets is actually 80% LESS than the face value that we charge the LTR holders?

    BEAUTIFUL

  2. Rick 11/21/2005 at 2:45 PM #

    LTRs have been the saving grace for ol’ Mr Fowler.
    They have kept the money flowing through frustrating and underperforming seasons.
    I dare say without them, we would have at least one fewer coach and probably a different AD.

  3. Mr. O 11/21/2005 at 3:03 PM #

    The money should be refunded to season ticket holders. That simply isn’t fair to the people who have LTRs.

  4. BJD95 11/21/2005 at 3:04 PM #

    Talk about the “Law of Unintended Consequences.” The LTR concept seemed like a good and equitable way to help finance facilities needed in order to compete at the highest level. But a side effect is apparently a “perpetual status quo” mentality that doesn’t care about competing at the highest level, and might very well actively prevent it from happening.

  5. Class of '74 11/21/2005 at 3:05 PM #

    the better longterm answer is don’t schedule these kind of games to begin with. then we have no marketing problems!

  6. Trout 11/21/2005 at 3:09 PM #

    ^ I disagree. I think the LTR concept has put even more pressure on winning, at least from the fan’s standpoint. People were never this upset with MOC, who had about the same ACC record as Amato after 6 years.

    As an LTR holder, this price difference doesnt bother me. As a SEASON TICKET Holder, who must purchase season tickets through my LTR contract, the price difference does bother me. NC State needs to sacrifice some $$$ for more equitable pricing. Simple laws of supply and demand. The demand to see VMI isnt very high, the price should reflect that for BOTH the season ticket holder and anyone who buys individual tickets.

  7. BJD95 11/21/2005 at 3:14 PM #

    People may be more unhappy, but not a damned thing has happened about it. And there’s no indication that anything ever will happen. (I care about the second sentence WAY more than the first.) Without being hit in the budget (as LTRs ensure), there’s not much incentive for a status quo-minded AD to make any waves whatsoever.

    As an aside, I don’t think I’ve ever seen a better example of putting lipstick on a pig. We’re 3-0! Against teams so bad that every scrub scored! Get your in-laws out of your house!

  8. Trout 11/21/2005 at 3:17 PM #

    ^ And what exactly were you wanting to happen?

  9. BJD95 11/21/2005 at 3:21 PM #

    I would like some assurance/hope that a coach COULD get fired for their objective, bottom line won/loss record. Not endless, unconditional votes of confidence.

  10. Class of '74 11/21/2005 at 3:33 PM #

    Trout, if you go shopping for steak and the butcher sells you on grain fed sirloin angus beef and you get home only to find you’ve got cube steak instead, would you be as upset as if you had intended to get cube steak all along? We’ve bought all of the sizzle of the new regime with the same old results.

  11. Trout 11/21/2005 at 3:37 PM #

    ^ Hey, I realize statefansnation has a definate view on Fowler and Sendek, and has now added Amato. I simply, IMO, have not seen anything from Herb or Amato in the past 4 years that would lead me to believe Fowler should remove either from their current position. Personally, I dont think ANY AD in America would fire Herb or Amato right now, or anytime over the past 4 years.

  12. Trout 11/21/2005 at 3:58 PM #

    ^ Who is the “butcher” in your scenario? Fowler, Amato, Oblinger, Sendek or MaryAnne Fox?

  13. Rick 11/21/2005 at 4:07 PM #

    I agree with both Trout and BJD. It has lead to more people unhappy because they cannot do anything about it.
    There is a sense of frustration that nothing they do matters.

  14. BJD95 11/21/2005 at 4:09 PM #

    Personally, I believe that it would be highly prudent to fire Amato if he loses on Saturday. I would let him know in no uncertain terms that his performance needs to improve significantly if he wants to keep his job, even with a win on Saturday.

    Sendek hasn’t done anything recently to warrant a firing, but he should have been on notice (and to some extent, should remain so) that his performance needs to improve.

  15. Jeff 11/21/2005 at 4:09 PM #

    Trout, I think that you are living in a dream world if you think that LTRs have put additional pressure on our coaches. The guaranteed revenue that is created by this extortion arrangement insulates the administration and coaches from experiencing any tangible consequences for failure to produce results.

    Rick, the sense of frustration that “nothing fans do matters” is created because there is so little that fans CAN DO. No traditional recourse exists for fans since we are tied to these LTRs. Then, you verbalize your dissatisfaction and you are labeled a “bad fan”.

  16. Trout 11/21/2005 at 4:14 PM #

    ^ I said LTRs have put more pressure on winning from the FAN’S view point. I stand by that comment.

    You and I BOUGHT LTRs, so I guess we are part of the problem them, right? How was NC State going to pay for all these facility upgrades?

    Why isnt the anger focused on Bobby Purcell and the WPC? They invented, marketed and sold the LTRs, right?

  17. BJD95 11/21/2005 at 4:20 PM #

    The LTRs were and are necessary. It just sucks that it also carried with it a disincentive for change. Perhaps this is only a problem because of the default nature of Lee Fowler.

  18. Trout 11/21/2005 at 4:22 PM #

    ^ And we are talking about program supporters, most of whom have paid a lot of money for LTRs and pay very high face values for these early-season cakewalk games. To turn around every year and sell tickets for $25 per ticket under what LTR and season ticket holders paid, IMO, is not a sound business decision long-term, because it devalues LTRs and season tickets. When they devalue those, they devalue the products they are most trying to sell (season tickets and LTRs). Not smart.

  19. Trout 11/21/2005 at 4:26 PM #

    ^ And I think LTRs also create pressure from the media as well. Whenever media people this season have written about Coach Amato and the underperforming results, they always mention the $$ that has been pumped into the program (throught the LTRs).

  20. Jeff 11/21/2005 at 4:27 PM #

    “I said LTRs have put more pressure on winning from the FAN’S view point. I stand by that comment”

    That’s fair. I misinterpreted your comments. And, i cery much agree with your last two comments.

  21. Class of '74 11/21/2005 at 4:37 PM #

    Sorry Trout, I was tied-up here but the bad butcher’s advice we bought was coming from Fox/Amato. Fowler is spineless IMHO. This marks the 3rd year of underachievement in football and it boils down to do you give Amato one more year or do you make a move at years end? I’m convinced he’ll get one more year but 6-5 next year or worse and the stands will look like saturday every game thereafter.

  22. Trout 11/21/2005 at 4:42 PM #

    ^ Okay, so what exactly was the “advice” Fox/Amato gave us? I ask this because I think the story has been twisted a bit. I hear people say that MAF and/or Amato promised a National Title, ACC Title, BCS bowls, etc., when I personally only heard that GOAL was to win those things. There is a difference.

    Amato DID promise that NC State wouldnt have another losing season, and he still has one more game to make that happen. I did hear that.

  23. Class of '74 11/21/2005 at 4:53 PM #

    Implied or inferred was a contender ala FSU. If you are content with the present then I say more power to you.
    I think underacheivement is just that, and in the face of all of the improvements that we have made to boost the program, well let’s just say I feel like a sucker who’s had his pocket picked.

  24. Trout 11/21/2005 at 5:02 PM #

    ^ I never said I was content. I’m disappointed as hell in this season. I dont think firing Amato right now is the right thing to do. But that’s me.

  25. Class of '74 11/21/2005 at 5:32 PM #

    I’m a firm believer in fixing problems quickly before they expand. I view the present situation as a problem that is not capable of self correction. We have
    a peter principle situation IMHO.

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